So I'd generally agree w/ the recieved wisdom that these 4 bands are the innovators who reworked the Sabbath business model of HEAVY in the 80s.

(Witchfinder General being a bit too NWOBHM-ish and not having the lifer commitment to the craft like these 4, IMO.)

Been on a big Pentagram kick recently, just figured out the different eras / lineups and how awesome and important Victor Griffin is, great instinctive riffs, the dropped B tuning is real interesting...

Never got into Trouble (though I keep trying).

I'm torn between liking Saint Vitus the most (Mournful Cries is one of my favourite records) and acknowledging how excellent the first two Candlemass albums are (lots of other good stuff in their catalogue, but the first two are just undeniably brilliant and powerful).

Which of these doom originators gets your vote?

I was hoping this was about the video game.

I like some early Pentagram but that's not very doom so I'll abstain.

Saint Vitus for me.

I just listened to Nightfall by Candlemass for the first time in 35 years. I listened to it quite a bit when it came out, then I never listened to it again. I don’t remember the singer’s vibrato being so over-the-top. Memories of moping in front of my stereo in my smelly messy teenage room came flooding back. I thought I was going to vote for Candlemass until I revisited them.

St. Vitus.

I appreciate their place in the SST pantheon. They were more or less rejected by both the punk and metal scenes at first, though the punkers came around before the metalheads.

It was between Trouble and Candlemass for me, but I gave CM the nod. Candlemass somehow manage to be the heaviest live band.

Trouble had the strongest complete album. They never really matched it later. Vitus guitar tones/wah abuse don’t do much for me, and when Wino joins the vocals go all to hell too. Couple great riffs in there though. Pentagram’s good stuff is the 70s to me, not really that doomy. Bobby’s voice goes downhill fast. Victor Griffin has his moments. Candlemass has some great riffs but Messiah’s vocals are just overwhelming in a cheesy 80s way. Bonus points for doom dancing.

None of these are crap, all are heavily waffled.

Trouble on the strength of the self-titled.

The Skull and Run to the Light are pretty strong records. The guitar tone on Psalm 9 fuckin' rules.

Candlemass debut (which has much better vocals to me than the stuff with Messiah) is the record that has meant the most to me and they were quite a big deal amongst metalheads here in sweden since they and Bathory were the only noteworthy "true" (as opposed to "poser") metal bands here in sweden before death metal happened-for some strange reason, swedes couldn't make good *thrash* metal at all... in general though, their more euro-cheese power metal take on doom with yngwie solos, stiff grooves and operatic vocals is not something I revisit much nowadays..

Trouble is another band I dug a lot and they have aged much better to me; I dig everything during their original run with the first two being my faves from a "doom" perspective. To me, those records weren't just killer doom but also records that fit well next to the more 70s judas Priest flavoured, less 80s Maiden worshipping US power-metal acts like Manilla Road, Cirith Ungol and Tyrant

Saint vitus is a bit odd to me in that unto them later due to the SST/Black flag connection. That comes through in their sound as well which feels more loose, raw and proto-sludge/grunge/stoner than the other bands. That said, I like those old records a lot but the *least* doomy one "Hallows victim" is actually my fave.

Pentagram I didn't even hear until Peaceville reissued the first two albums after they were constantly namechecked by Cathedral. Relentless is GREAT though but the new releases that followed were pretty bad music IMO. I dig the "First daze here"-comp with 70s stuff alot though but that is hardly "doom".

Overall, Candlemass feels like the most important and their influence transcended doom and was heard a lot in the slower sections of swedish death metal bands which tended to have the same type of "melancholic" progressions (a US death act like Autopsy owed more to Trouble and-on Mental funeral-even Melvins for the slow aspect IMO) and since their debut is an all-time fave, I vote for them. "Relentless" is the album I have played the most from these bands in the past 30 years or so though...

Side-note: If I'm allowed to dork out metal-nerd style, I'd argue that Celtic Frost deserves more props for re-introducing the Sabbath aspect in metal than they get and were probably more important in that regard than any of the 80s doom bands. While most of their sludgy songs had faster sections, you still have full-on (well, if you ignore the aural ugliness doom tunes in "Triumph of death" (Hellhammer), dawn of meggido, Necromantical screams and Caress into oblivion.

More importantly, the combination of a chromatic/thrash style (as opposed to blooze *or* minor key) tonal language and grunted, amelodic vocals made the doom aspect more extreme metal compatible and it's really their influence you hear even on a lot of more "regular" later doom albums (think first Cathedral)

BTW, the band Dream death who put out one killer album back in the late 80s on New Renaissanceare kind of the missing link between Celtic Frost and later doom-death styles.

Sidenote: I obviously don't consider CF "doom"; I just think it's important that their contributions to the slow&heavy in the 80's gets recognized.