"Neil Young has been called the "Godfather of Grunge", and has had albums such as Rust Never Sleeps and Ragged Glory described as proto-grunge and grunge."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grunge

"Another emo band which emerged at the same time was California's Weezer, which also released its self-titled debut album in 1994" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emo

Al Gore invented the Internet?

Neil Young was being described as such when grunge was contemporary.

As for Weezer I got nothin', but "emo" gets put on pretty much anything that's sad and punk-adjacent.

joe_lmr wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 2:04 am Neil Young was being described as such when grunge was contemporary.

As for Weezer I got nothin', but "emo" gets put on pretty much anything that's sad and punk-adjacent.

I personally think the Neil Young is grunge thing is bullshit. Because look, we all know the grunge wave was whatever 1986/1987+ Maybe 1985 the earliest. I don't know a ton about the history really, but I know enough... And it was Melvins, Mudhoney etc. has nothing to do with Neil Young, Don't know why he's included in any history of it. Whenever that Scratch Acid LP was issued... 80s. They're more important than Neil Young is in terms of "grunge" wave responsibility.

As far as Weezer... It's flagrant. They're not an emo band. Not even close, really.

Seems like a major wave happens, then suddenly some (already known) artists claim they started it first, or become "attributed" to the "invention of the sound," but really think: If these major trend waves didn't happen 20+ years after Neil Young (and 20+ years after Rites of Spring, 10+ years after Weezer... or whoever)... then what? Guess those artists didn't invent anything, did they?

Beyond Emo and Grunge, there's other genres that have similar rewritten histories... Disco, Psychedelic rock, it goes on and on.

With the Internet as well... Right now you can find some artist, somewhere... who sounds like something... so in 20+ years when a wave of music comes around that sounds somewhat similar to them, all of the sudden they're the pioneers for that wave, or the "Godfather" of the wave? Sorry, no. Not how it works. Just my opinion though.

FWIW Mudhoney always cited The Stooges, Blue Cheer, and early Neil Young as big influences - along with The Scientists. When I listen to Mudhoney this is what I hear.

You know that the intro to Mudhoney's "Broken Hands" is the Outro to Neil Young and Crazy Horse's "Cinnamon Girl", right? Let alone that they sound like the very same band. The homage is brazen, open worship on Mudhoney's part:

seby wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 2:29 am FWIW Mudhoney always cited The Stooges, Blue Cheer, and early Neil Young as big influences - along with The Scientists. When I listen to Mudhoney this is what I hear.

You know that the intro to Mudhoney's "Broken Hands" is the Outro to Neil Young and Crazy Horse's "Cinnamon Girl", right? Let alone that they sound like the very same band. The homage is brazen, open worship on Mudhoney's part:

Yeah, this is exactly my point. Mudhoney is the grunge band. They were "influenced" by Neil Young. Neil Young didn't invent grunge, though. To say his music sounds like grunge is kind of a stretch, no?

So as a hypothesis... Neil Young has nothing to do with the Grunge wave really. Other than bands that invented the sound liked his stuff and were "influenced" by him. Side note: how many artists bring up bullshit influences that sound nothing like their music for cred points or to trick the listener into trying to figure out how that influence plays through in their music. Or their kidding completely. An appropriate example for these boards: Britt Walford saying in an interview he was listening to Madonna on repeat while recording Tweez (or Spiderland, I forgot). I guess Madonna invented Slint. Fuck yeah!!!

Same exact situation with emo. Some of the actual pioneers of the sound credited their "influences" which came whatever, 20 years prior. But those influences weren't directly involved in starting the actual wave that solidified the musical genre into existence.

Seems like subgenres have way more accurate pages on Wiki. For instance, pg. 99 and city of caterpillar are credited as inventing Screamo, which is seemingly much more true than Weezer being an emo band. But again, I'm not an expert really, just starting the conversation.

Neil Young and Crazy Horse and Mudhoney sound very similar to me. So to the extent that Mudhoney are grunge, and NYaCH sound like Mudhoney, it follows that NYaCH sound like grunge. Cinnamon Girl could literally be a Mudhoney sound. So no, I do not think it a stretch to say that NYaCH sound like grunge. I think that it is apparent they they do, to the point of its being truistic.

I have a Melody Maker poster from 1991 giving “The A to Z of Grunge”, and Neil Young is right there, four out of four stars, “Vert to the f’ckin’ max” if I remember the key correctly. I can dig it out for anyone interested in grunge-period paraphernalia - it sent me off on a year or so of searching for “Spiderland”, which ended with my being very surprised they didn’t sound much like Sonic Youth, with whom NY and Crazy Horse were touring.

Dinosaur Jr were regularly being compared to NY & CH with good reason, and “Weld/Arc”and “Ragged Glory” were slaying visages in the same circles. Cobain was obviously a big fan, and then there was “The Bridge” tribute album, populated by various Grunge-bannered bands across the quality scale.

Pretty grungy!

indiegrab_360 wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 12:22 am "Neil Young has been called the "Godfather of Grunge", and has had albums such as Rust Never Sleeps and Ragged Glory described as proto-grunge and grunge."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grunge

"Another emo band which emerged at the same time was California's Weezer, which also released its self-titled debut album in 1994" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emo

Al Gore invented the Internet?

Al Gore did a lot of legislation and advocacy for the projects that became the internet, and never claimed to have invented it in a technical sense.

You might argue that Neil Young similarly paved the way for grunge without having played anything in the genre (at least until after it was established), although it’s a stretch. That Weezer quote is nonsense, though, like so much Wikipedia.

Gil Scott-Heron being called 'the godfather of rap' due to a handful of spoken word songs, when the majority of his music and singing is dynamic and soulful.

People gonna simplify, ya know?

Lord, emo. I'm on this 90s hardcore/punk/emo Facebook group where people share cool records and nostalgia. Once in a while someone gets on a high horse about "real emo" and I always bristle. If Rites of Spring, Angel Hair and Christie Front Drive are all emo then wtf is emo anyway? Weezer isn't really emo but emo isn't really real.