I find abortion an unacceptable response to an unexpected or unwanted pregnancy. If my girlfriend got pregnant, even though I would not be ready for such, I would be loathe to choose the path of terminating the pregnancy. However, if she was adamant, I would not stop her via some sort of melo-dramatic display or, god forbid, some type of physical act. It is her body. This derives from the same set of values which lead me to believe that I have no right to insist that a mother jump into fast moving water to save a child of hers which has fallen into the current. As it turns out, our nation's most primary, overarching values include a respect for the individual to have control over their body. In many instances this means that the government will be expected to keep its hands to itself. This is in part due to a need or a desire to give each individual the best opportunity to care for themselves, to achieve some manner of happiness. For better or for worse this includes considerations of economic wherewithal. Women have enough trouble getting paid their worth and avoiding the stigma of their gender. I work in the employment field and I will tell you that many employers begin the weeding out process when they sniff a pregnancy. At any rate, the purposeful and premature termination of pregnancy is a method for controlling one's body, for controlling one's social and economic viability which is not, in my view, necessarily wrong. In many instances it might be considered responsible (lack of funds, lack of desire to care for the child, etc.). I would prefer that the abortion occur before the fetus has matured to a point wherein it can exist outside of the womb (even if said existence is buttressed by the best medical tech). After that point I believe that a state body might have a very valid interest in protecting the fetus. I realize that this is a slippery slope argument and, as it is subject to expansions or contractions based on the available tech, it will likely annoy those who live to breath in the crisp air of moral certitude. Tough shit. There is nothing inherently wrong with a reasoned course of action based on guidelines which apply according to shifting circumstances. That is life.

The best course of action would be better overall education and employment opportunities coupled with the promotion of well-rounded views on sex and its consequences. Give people the best chance to behave intelligently (though that likely works against many individual natures) and to avoid unwanted pregnancies.

[quote="ch029448"] Whereas, most of the Pro-Life arguments read something along the lines of: "It's Murder. God said so, in the bible."

That's the funny part. The bible says no such thing. Mind you, I think the bible is generally a bunch of fairy tales anyway, but I do know that it does NOT address the issue of abortion at all. If anything, it indirectly condones it.

There is a part in exodus where it talks about the eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth rule, and it says that if a miscarriage happens as a result of an injury to a woman, the person who caused the miscarriage is to be FINED. If the biblical authors (gawd, at least indirectly, if you believe this stuff) considered the fetus to be fully human, it would have to call for murder of he who caused the miscarriage.

Also, it says that life begins with the first breath, which we all know doesn't happen inside the womb. There is a lot if inofrmation to back this stuf up if anyone is interested.

Just thought I would point this out. It wasn't until pat robertson came along that the xian right adopted abortion as a pet issue. People think they are following the bible, but in fact they are just following pat robertson and other asshole millionaire evangelicals.

I love having the last word. I am just too cool.

Mike Stanton wrote: If you dont think that "aborting a pregnancy" is cold blooded murder you are wrong.

It's people like this that make me glad I live in an civilised country. No, I don't think "aborting a pregnancy" is murder, an ex-partner and I when through an abortion. Neither of us think it is anything to hide or be ashamed of. It was her choice and I supported the decision.

I'll tell you a secret, it's the answer to everyone's option about abortion:

If it's not you or your partner having the abortion it's none of your fuckin' business

That's it...

I have to say this is really an American debate, here in Europe and in Australasia we don't let theists bully their own way in public policy. As I said, if it ain't you fuck off and mind your own business!

I think we should all calm down and mull the issue over by doing a short Bible Abortion Quiz.


Better?

I can't now imagine wanting my kid to be aborted, but I considered it before my daughter was born. It makes my blood run cold to think about that time. Abortion is a subject that is probably best discussed by people who don't have kids.

In the US, it seems beyond ironic that a similar demographic deplores abortion while supporting acts of war. Also supporting a right-wing government that seems uninterested in the future of the planet, or the welfare state.

I guess once you're born, it's evvery boy or girl for themselves?

Champ Rab, has hit the nail on the head. It's is a person choice.

I'm pro-abortion but that doesn't mean that if my girlfriend and I got pregnant we'd abort. But if she wanted to theists have no right to force their religion on anyone else.

jupiter wrote:The young are always born before that happens.

Does that matter? Dead is dead.

jupiter wrote:How are you gonna argue that abortion is not unnatural?

Well, that depends on what you mean by natural. Besides, what does that have to do with anything? Eyeglasses are unnatural, cars are unnatural, so?

abortions should be safely conducted, legal and rare

lots of emphasis on the last part, i think the less it happened the happier everyone would be?

making abortion illegal would probably be just awful, i wonder if a lot of women would try and do it anyway.

isn't a lot of the information the government sends to schools/health centers/etc really misleading when it comes to abortion? i remember reading somewhere that all the facts where totally skewed. anyway that shit should stop also, in order to cut down on the number of unwanted pregnancies you should give people solid information on how to prevent knocking each other up, not try to scare them with fake information

I think the legal cut-off age for terminating a child's life should be somewhere around 7 and 3/4. By that time time you can pretty much tell if he's going to be a bastard.