Marsupialized wrote:They did come in and put down roots in every one of those neighborhoods, and in the process made all the people who had lived there their whole lives rip up THEIR roots and move on....but that's only fair, right? A city is only a great city if it attracts rich people to live in it, right? Let's ignore everyone who is 'stuck' here as you say and focus on making sure all the nice rich yuppies feel comfortable here. Who's making sure those 'stuck' people are comfortable? It's their fucking city too, or do they count less because they don't have much money? I find nothing instantly noble in having enough money to move wherever you want, and I don't see the sense in trying so hard to attract those types that you leave everyone who's here already out in the cold.

I agree with what you're saying. I also think that a city that can balance its neighborhoods with a mix of incomes and classes is ideal. I don't necessarily agree with the practices of all developers in this town or at all with the practices of the past. Racism and poorly thought out migration combined to fuel the decline of the city in the past. It's future success depends upon the ability to attract ALL people, including those with the financial clout to make it real.

I don't like the practices and misappropriations of the mayor's office any more than you do, but I can appreciate his ability to accomplish what has been a struggle and failure for so many other city governments. He makes things happen, and in a way that cuts a lot of the other crap you see in many other liberal city governments. Coming from Madison, not a goddamn thing could be accomplished without endless studies, surveys, hearings, and academic fiddle-fucking around. Only if concensus prevailed was anything accomplished, and often by the time it was, it was too little or too late for the policies to have the desired effect. As a city gets larger the lack of inertia and action can be devastating.

I agree that a worthwhile education system benefits all. So do parks, greenspace, museums, cultural facilities and events, and clean safe streets. It's unreasonable to focus on specific neighborhoods that have been blighted for 50 to 80 years or more to change in short order if the city would just throw more money at it. It also takes a population that can and will appreciate such overtures, not all of which you'll find in the area you've mentioned.

Do you want to live in a city that exists as little more than a refugee camp or welfare city-state for the poor and uneducated? I believe in social equity, but that does not come solely from a mayorial office spending revenue that has no source.

Honestly, did you live here before the "gentrification"? You live at California and Irving Park, which isn't a ghetto by any stretch of the imagination. Do you think a mayor, any mayor, could directly enact changes that would make you want to up and move to Austin or Englewood in the next year or two? You seem to have a choice and have chosen to live closer to the yuppies than not. I think there's a balance that hopefully will improve as time goes on, I hope.

geiginni wrote:

Marsupialized wrote:They did come in and put down roots in every one of those neighborhoods, and in the process made all the people who had lived there their whole lives rip up THEIR roots and move on....but that's only fair, right? A city is only a great city if it attracts rich people to live in it, right? Let's ignore everyone who is 'stuck' here as you say and focus on making sure all the nice rich yuppies feel comfortable here. Who's making sure those 'stuck' people are comfortable? It's their fucking city too, or do they count less because they don't have much money? I find nothing instantly noble in having enough money to move wherever you want, and I don't see the sense in trying so hard to attract those types that you leave everyone who's here already out in the cold.

I agree with what you're saying. I also think that a city that can balance its neighborhoods with a mix of incomes and classes is ideal. I don't necessarily agree with the practices of all developers in this town or at all with the practices of the past. Racism and poorly thought out migration combined to fuel the decline of the city in the past. It's future success depends upon the ability to attract ALL people, including those with the financial clout to make it real.

I don't like the practices and misappropriations of the mayor's office any more than you do, but I can appreciate his ability to accomplish what has been a struggle and failure for so many other city governments. He makes things happen, and in a way that cuts a lot of the other crap you see in many other liberal city governments. Coming from Madison, not a goddamn thing could be accomplished without endless studies, surveys, hearings, and academic fiddle-fucking around. Only if concensus prevailed was anything accomplished, and often by the time it was, it was too little or too late for the policies to have the desired effect. As a city gets larger the lack of inertia and action can be devastating.

I agree that a worthwhile education system benefits all. So do parks, greenspace, museums, cultural facilities and events, and clean safe streets. It's unreasonable to focus on specific neighborhoods that have been blighted for 50 to 80 years or more to change in short order if the city would just throw more money at it. It also takes a population that can and will appreciate such overtures, not all of which you'll find in the area you've mentioned.

Do you want to live in a city that exists as little more than a refugee camp or welfare city-state for the poor and uneducated? I believe in social equity, but that does not come solely from a mayorial office spending revenue that has no source.

Honestly, did you live here before the "gentrification"? You live at California and Irving Park, which isn't a ghetto by any stretch of the imagination. Do you think a mayor, any mayor, could directly enact changes that would make you want to up and move to Austin or Englewood in the next year or two? You seem to have a choice and have chosen to live closer to the yuppies than not. I think there's a balance that hopefully will improve as time goes on, I hope.

I've lived here my entire life in a bunch of different neighborhoods. I live in this neighborhood now because it's NOT a yuppie neighborhood, it's as blue collar as they come. I grew up in the semi-ghetto, and I went to a shitty gangbanger high school, where the teachers were fucking morons. Anyway, I'm not so much bitching about the 'gentification' or whatever, people can move wherever they like, it's a free country. What I am pissed about is basically this overall attitude of 'fuck those poor people' that seems to be all the rage these days. It's like noone understands at all what it's like to struggle and be in a bad spot and trying to fight your way out, people seem to be a little too comfortable driving their SUV's and buying their condos, knowing people are out there starving and hungry and who don't have a chance....I have all the respect in the world for the guy who has been through the ringer, works his ass off and does his thing and gets by....the kid with the trust fund, who never had a want or need that wasn't taken care of instantly who says 'Oh, those poor people are just lazy' how much respect can you have for that? Zero.
Are people in general just mean spirited evil greedy selfish fucks? I used to not think so.

Marsupialized wrote:I've lived here my entire life in a bunch of different neighborhoods. I live in this neighborhood now because it's NOT a yuppie neighborhood, it's as blue collar as they come. I grew up in the semi-ghetto, and I went to a shitty gangbanger high school, where the teachers were fucking morons. Anyway, I'm not so much bitching about the 'gentification' or whatever, people can move wherever they like, it's a free country. What I am pissed about is basically this overall attitude of 'fuck those poor people' that seems to be all the rage these days. It's like noone understands at all what it's like to struggle and be in a bad spot and trying to fight your way out, people seem to be a little too comfortable driving their SUV's and buying their condos, knowing people are out there starving and hungry and who don't have a chance....I have all the respect in the world for the guy who has been through the ringer, works his ass off and does his thing and gets by....the kid with the trust fund, who never had a want or need that wasn't taken care of instantly who says 'Oh, those poor people are just lazy' how much respect can you have for that? Zero.
Are people in general just mean spirited evil greedy selfish fucks? I used to not think so.

Agreed....completely. I also respect you having lived here your whole life and staying. I love Chicago, but I am not from here. It was my first choice as a place I could practice my profession (beating out NY, DC, Atlanta, and pretty much every other city in the US with the exception of San Fran or Portland). I grew up in a faceless Milwaukee area suburb that I have no attachment to whatsoever. In that sense I lack roots and a pride in the place I grew up. I somewhat envy the idea of growing up in a place you'd want to stay as an adult.

geiginni wrote:

Marsupialized wrote:I've lived here my entire life in a bunch of different neighborhoods. I live in this neighborhood now because it's NOT a yuppie neighborhood, it's as blue collar as they come. I grew up in the semi-ghetto, and I went to a shitty gangbanger high school, where the teachers were fucking morons. Anyway, I'm not so much bitching about the 'gentification' or whatever, people can move wherever they like, it's a free country. What I am pissed about is basically this overall attitude of 'fuck those poor people' that seems to be all the rage these days. It's like noone understands at all what it's like to struggle and be in a bad spot and trying to fight your way out, people seem to be a little too comfortable driving their SUV's and buying their condos, knowing people are out there starving and hungry and who don't have a chance....I have all the respect in the world for the guy who has been through the ringer, works his ass off and does his thing and gets by....the kid with the trust fund, who never had a want or need that wasn't taken care of instantly who says 'Oh, those poor people are just lazy' how much respect can you have for that? Zero.
Are people in general just mean spirited evil greedy selfish fucks? I used to not think so.

Agreed....completely. I also respect you having lived here your whole life and staying. I love Chicago, but I am not from here. It was my first choice as a place I could practice my profession (beating out NY, DC, Atlanta, and pretty much every other city in the US with the exception of San Fran or Portland). I grew up in a faceless Milwaukee area suburb that I have no attachment to whatsoever. In that sense I lack roots and a pride in the place I grew up. I somewhat envy the idea of growing up in a place you'd want to stay as an adult.

I suppose it's just how I was raised, Chicago was always our home and it always will be. I bitch about the weather and the government and the traffic, but it's still the only place I'd ever feel at home. I get so passionate about this stuff because I have been here so long and I've seen it from every angle, I have straight up ghetto friends and I have straight up Lincoln Park highrise friends...and they are all pretty much the same. People are people. Not everyone gets the same opportunities, not everyone gets the same luck. The fact some people can't see that and dismiss people in the poor neighborhoods as just stupid and lazy and not willing to help themselves really pisses me off. The fact that the most generous, decent people I've ever met are also the poorest really strikes a nerve with me.
I know I sound like a hypocrite because I talk so much shit about 'yuppies' as I'm sure there's plenty of good, decent people who live that way and there are plenty of decent good people who do good things with their trust funds....but come on, when I see a giant piss colored hummer parked on southport I just wanna fucking murder the guy driving it...how could you not?

Mayor Daley once held the door open for me at the YMCA

There's this dude in our building who has a picture of a younger Richy on his wall facing the hallway so as you walk by you can't avoid seeing his highness.

jcamanei wrote:There's this dude in our building who has a picture of a younger Richy on his wall facing the hallway so as you walk by you can't avoid seeing his highness.

The one of him in McCormick Place must be from when he was State's Atty. You'd think after 90 years in office, he woulda had a Teamster put up a new photo.

Three years ago tomorrow this thread was started and Daley is still da King. I guess he's more bulletproof than I gave him credit for.

Oh and Geginni I call bullshit on what you consider a "stake" in the city. Just because you rent doesn't mean you don't have one. I grew up there, have family and friends there and a lot of positive and negative memories from there. I was educated there, paid taxes there, and struggled to survive there. My stake is just as valid and just as real as any property owner.

What ignorant bullshit you spouted.

I share the same love/hate feelings regarding Daley expressed (apparently three years ago) in this here thread. I'll just add that unlike a lot of other politicians one thing about Daley is that he has no further political ambition than to be the Mayor. He does this job because he wants Chicago to be the best city it can, period. I mean, just take a look at the Governor or the state legislature, at least shit DOES get done in the city.

Only three pages on this thread?
I guess some people need to start moving to Bensenville or at least west of Western to cultivate some bitterness towards the Daley gestapo.
Too many people in chicago are too comfortable or too hopeless by Daley's legacy. That 30% voting turn out proves it.