I like the idea of getting into vegetarianism for health reasons, but if I really wanted to get into shape there are other things I could do than go vegetarian, like, start working out, or stop eating so much junk food and sitting around.

A girl I know went vegetarian because she had a dream in which she rescued a chicken from being killed, and when she woke up, she couldn't bring herself to eat meat. That's an interesting way to do it. She's been vegetarian for a while, as far as I know.

I don't really care much about animal rights. I have two dogs that I love, and of course I wouldn't consider eating them, but I could care less about some cow or chicken that I'm never going to see. I think even if I needed to kill the animal I was going to eat, I would probably still eat meat. I think PETA is a pretty fucked up organization- I hate their politics, their bullshit propaganda, and the way that they make up shit to further their agenda. I know it's a cliche now, but there are PEOPLE dying, and I believe that if you truly believe that people are no better than animals, YOU are no better than an animal. It's kind of a weird paradox, but I hold "animal-rights activists" in the highest contempt.

If you just don't like eating animals, though, that's cool, as long as I don't have to sit through a lecture. Here are some other reasons I wouldn't want to go vegetarian:
-Prime rib
-Bacon and eggs
-Souvlaki
-Cheeseburgers
-Gyros
-Other steaks

I watched my father slit a goat's throat once.




Faiz

Hi, I like to drive around in a wastefull, gas guzzling SUV.... I know it's really bad for the environment and everything, but I don't care. I'll drive two blocks to the convenience store just to get some pork rinds...... I'm American and I do whatever I want and can't be fucked correcting all the reasons not to be a lazy dick. It's just that I like to drive, the bigger and more wasteful a vehicle the more I enjoy it. My personal pleasure is of far more concern than my health or the health of those around me or the environment, economy, and besides if I didn't waste so much gas than I'd be putting the people that work for the oil companies out of a job.

-n

n.c. wrote:Hi, I like to drive around in a wastefull, gas guzzling SUV.... I know it's really bad for the environment and everything, but I don't care. I'll drive two blocks to the convenience store just to get some pork rinds...... I'm American and I do whatever I want and can't be fucked correcting all the reasons not to be a lazy dick. It's just that I like to drive, the bigger and more wasteful a vehicle the more I enjoy it. My personal pleasure is of far more concern than my health or the health of those around me or the environment, economy, and besides if I didn't waste so much gas than I'd be putting the people that work for the oil companies out of a job.

-n

hi, i only get about 18mpg in my toyota 4runner. i woulda got something with better mpg, but in a cost-benefit analysis looking at things like fuel economy, cargo space, reliability, and cost, this one came up aces. when my friend gave me a couch, i didn't have to rent a truck to pick it up. when i bought wood to sound-insulate my basement, i didn't have to rent a truck to go buy it. when i play a gig, or go jam at somebody else's place, or buy a good-sized mixing console, i don't have to rent a truck. in a dream world, i ride my bike to work, but with my backpack coming in around 25 to 30 lbs, and the increase in travel time bumping it up from 30 minutes round trip to i'm not sure how many hours round trip, i drive. in another dream world, i buy a second car, a little dinky one like a civic or even better a hybrid, and i use *that* to get to work and back. but alas, i'm not rich like that.

oh, and i also can use my 4runner to go pick up a pizza with pepperoni on it. and hopefully run over countless insects on my way there. because they're so much less relevant than cows.

jeez, bleeding hearts club band, can we all just be for real, and convert to Jainism and get it over with? rather than be all half-assed about it? since we know that enlightenment = doing everything reasonable to make sure we never even kill bugs, on accident. like, for real.

intern_8033, you are kinda sorta jokin' in your kinda sorta jokin' way, which i enjoy. it's a good way, and i'm not kinda sorta jokin' about that.

but i'm not joking when i say that, in this way, on this issue, you ARE ethically and morally superior to me and to anyone else who eats meat

we really have no good reason to do so, other than that we like the way it tastes and it's easier to be a meat eater whilst traveling by car

n.c. wrote:When was the last time you got sick? Me? It's been way over 5 years, and since I cut out Cheese? Nothin' I feel great all the time. I haven't called in sick to a job the 5 years I've lived in Chicago.
-n

-n

Sounds like a good reason to eat meat to me - it gets you outta work!

I eat a lot of meat as of today, and usually enjoy it thoroughly. However, I'm also a fat-ass with high cholesterol and diminishing health.

Several years ago I became a vegan for about 6 months. I lost about 30 pounds and felt better than I ever had. Then I moved to Chicago and became enchanted with its carnivorous Sandbergian delights. Reading this topic reminded me of those salad days, and I now state publicly that I shall return to my vegan lifestyle post-haste -- the veganism of Dr. John McDougall, who believes that meat and dairy products can be enjoyed on festive occasions, but should not be a part of a regular diet.

TMH makes a good point about going for it: why pussyfoot around in some kind of postmodern, existential haze of dread, guilt, regret... Having said that, after reading the Twelve Vows, I'm wondering why Vow Number One bothers with this caveat: "He may use force, if necessary, in the defense of his country, society, family, life, property, religious institute."


Why not denounce the use of force entirely if you're going to be hardcore? If all men lived by this ethic, no man would ever die at the hands of another man. It's like at those nudist camps where they cover their erections. You're standing right at the gate, man! Just walk on through!

OK.

why pussyfoot around in some kind of postmodern, existential haze of dread, guilt, regret...

for honesty's sake

and please don't ignore the ramifications of actions for the purpose of opposing people you don't like

-n. l. s.

why is it that the most super-special, top-notch species, the one with the most moral obligation to be all top-notch and enlightened, is the one that fails the most miserably in that task, the one that destroys everything for ourselves and practically every other living thing? hook me up.

Mercy me, sounds like you're talking about AMERICA. Baby, supersize me one more time!

Maybe it has something to do with power, how it's attained, how it entrenches and perpetuates itself, and does everything to set the limits of the game (ie, what is reasonable, thinkable, doable, and so on).

The whole man vs. nature grade 10 analysis sure has been fun though!


My biggest stumbling block on the road to devout vegetarianism has been that I'm chickenshit. On those thankfully rare occasions when I vacation at family gatherings, strangers' weddings, bar mitzvah rehearsals, and seniors lodges, etc, I can't bring myself to be a pain in the ass and make people feel shitty that i'm just eating the canned stringbeans. I feel like buddy from Van Halen requesting no XXXXX M & Ms on the rider.

Other than that I'm 94.76 % vegetarian. And when I was treeplanting for 14 hours a day at serious altitude and not eating any meat, I was in the best shape of my life (*note to self* must recall: was I popping psuedoephedrine thrice a day??)

Still, they've got to come up with a soy milk that doesn't separate in coffee. Nothin' goes into good coffee like the zesty white stuff of a cow's breast.

Impressive thread though, I expected an uninterupted sausage fest.

I've also eaten brains on toast for breakfast.




Faiz