Hi,

Can anyone give me some serious pointers for getting a good bass-sound recorded?
Using a straight signal makes it sound rather dull and nothing like the actual sound.
How about mics? wich ones and where?
I use a 15" Ampeg speaker and sometimes add a mu-tron like filter [from my doepfer filter] and a little distortion. Should i mix them in after the recording?

dear electrical someone,

what should i do?

christophe

Here's some obvious suggestions
beyer m88
beyer m380
EV re-20/pl-20
AT 4033
AT 4047
sennheiser 421
Akg D112
Most of these mics are large diaphragm dynamics with the exception of the AT's, which are condensors. also any of them would be useful on other than bass cabinet sources with the exception of the m380. What mics do you own or have access to? It's true that i prefer placing a mic on an amp i've seldom found the results of taking a direct signal from the bass to be dull. artificial,yes but dull no . how does the bass sound through the amp.-daniel

hi

my $.02:

the beyer m380 is the best at getting deep bass on tape

i think the tgx-50 is a similar mic, supposedly

if the bass sound is very deep w/little high end, the 380 works nicely on its own. otherwise, it's best used in combination with something bright--any of many different various small-diaphragm condensers would do fine.

d112 and m88 are decent basic mics for bass, but the 380+condenser combo is my favorite

If you nice size budget I would highly recommend a neumann u47fet.

b.

I use a Yamaha (I can hear the growns already...) 200 watt (100 per channel?) solid state head from the late 70's? Early 80's? (sorry, don't have model number in front of me...). It has amazing eq on it and a very good sounding xlr out. I swear this thing with a tiny bit of compression while tracking sounds SO GOOD. I know it should not, but it does, time after time. It's my own 60 lb DI. My bass tracks like it sounds to me when I am playing and seems to find it's place in the mix well.

Also for extra fullness I sometimes do that trick of duplicating the bass track to another track and slightly shifting them out of phase and hard panning them opposite each other. Easy trick. Sounds good if you have room in your mix and the extra track to spare.

...also to the question of including effects on the bass sound while recording or waiting for later... That is an underlying theme in the book Behind The Glass which a great book of techy interviews with successful recordists. Seems for the most part the Brits print all gadgetry to tape while us Yanks wait until later to add in the extras. It is funny how this is reinforced interview after interview. Great book! Why is Steve not in it?

Thanks chaps,

I do have e D112, but don't really like it much for miking the speaker.
I will try the large diaphragms though.

I got some nice results by mixing a little distortion with the dry signal in the mix instead of the recording. this gives you the opportunity to split the signal for a bit of stereo image. Same goes for straight signal combined with miked cabinet signal.

I find it best to mix through the doepfer-filter after recording the dry track
since the mix asks for different amounts of modulation then a live sound;
sometimes it won't come through, othertimes it will cut through the mix too much. So, I just rerecord the whole track by running the original recording through the filter etc.
It's a good idea to keep twidling the knobs in realtime as you let it record.

Has anybody got any specific tips on placement for the mics?

merci ,

christophe

It all starts with a nice sounding bass that is in tune and intonated. Really.

If that ain't in place, the rest is for naught....

If it is in place, then choose the amp, D.I., etc. so that it does not fuck up the sound. If you can't picture/hear the sound in your head before you are recording it, you have less of a chance of stumbling across a pleasant surprise as you are poking around for the exact sound.

In other words, have an aim in mind and then seek it.

Kind of along with that thought - I've found that you have to not try to capture the live sound as much as hear it as it might apply to everything else. This includes picturing the eventual overdubs (if you're doing a lot of those), picturing any effects or mixing tricks, anticipating edit points, what format the music will end up on (LP, mp3, etc). Maybe it's just been my experience, but I've found the best live bass sounds did not transfer spectacularly onto tape.

I would suggest really trying to figure out what kind of bass tone you prefer and are trying to achieve. Bass can occupy so many dimensions in a band and a recording. In my own playing and recording I am always on a constant search for tone that lies somewhere between Paul McCartney and John Paul Jones, but even their tone varies so much throughout the years. Pick a song for reference that you love the bass tone and just go for that. I would agree that the bass and the amp that player is using has a large effect on the tone, but most importantly it comes from the player. If you are trying to get a McCartney sound from the Limp Bicuit bassist, its just not gonna happen. Once you figure out what you sound you want, then use the appropriate gear to direct you closer to your goal. My mic cabinet (i.e. my wallet) is very shallow right now but I have had good luck with the d112 and a 57. I think the d112 sounds much better on a bass cabinet than on a kick drum. You can really accentuate the ultra low frequencies (around 50-90hz) with it. The 57 is good for getting the bass to punch through the mix more when the bass does more of a melodic duty, but you can still get a deep sound by really taking advantage of the proximity effect and pushing the mic as close to the speaker as possible. If you have these mics and can't get the sound you want, but can't afford buying other mics, just keep experimenting with mic placement, amp eq adjustment, the room that you have the amp in, etc. Even if you close mic a cabinet the sound of the room is still going to have an effect on the tone. If you want a brighter sound, put the cabinet on a wood or linoleum floor or something with a reflectivity in the higher frequencies. So much can be acheived by changing the variables of the sound from the source to that point of capture, the mic is only one variable in the equation.
Good luck.