connor wrote:

steve wrote:If this record is from that brief period where New Order just sounded like Joy Division with a different singer, then I should listen to it. I don't remember such an album existing, but it is possible.

Movement is pretty damn close. It lacks many of the kitschy dance accoutrements that you've listed here.

Other than that record, I stick mainly to the first few singles and a few select tracks from Power and Low-Life.

The first single sounds like Joy Division (both songs wer JD songs) with somebody else singing - somebodyo besides Sumner too, I think...That single and much of Movement seem to have other band members singing...Steve Morris, maybe?

cesb wrote:The first single sounds like Joy Division (both songs wer JD songs) with somebody else singing - somebodyo besides Sumner too, I think...That single and much of Movement seem to have other band members singing...Steve Morris, maybe?

I'm pretty sure it's Bernard Sumner singing on "In a Lonely Place" and both New Order versions of "Ceremony" (with and without Gillian Gilbert). There were some demos recorded at Cabaret Voltaire's Western Works, and I think Stephen Morris might sing the version of "Ceremony" recorded then. The vocals sound strange on my bootleg copy of these songs, so it's a bit hard to tell.

Peter Hook sings "Dreams Never End" and "Doubts Even Here" on Movement, and Gillian Gilbert does some talking on the latter (which is my all-time favorite New Order song). I'm 99.9% certain Bernard Sumner sings the rest of the songs on Movement.

Sorry for this lengthy, nerdy post!

steve wrote:If this record is from that brief period where New Order just sounded like Joy Division with a different singer, then I should listen to it. I don't remember such an album existing, but it is possible.

I do remember liking little things about New Order, like the occasional guitar line, bass ornament or vocal delivery, but I remember more clearly all the stuff I disliked:

*Linn Drum benching a fantastic and unique drummer.
*Defining a supremely phony sound that became ubiquitous.
*Sequencer as principle performer
*Roland Jazz Chorus
*Mock-scratching, DDL loops and symphonic stab samples

Joy Division was bleak, timeless (not of its time) and energetic. New Order was urbane, self-conciously modern, lazy and kitschy. Being unkind, I could call it club music. And detestable.

Although I haven't listened to them enough recently to be sure of it, I'm inclined to say fuck New Order. They knew what they were capable of and did this Arthur Baker crap instead.

You should probably look into Low-Life or Brotherhood instead.

While not my favorite New Order record, this record has my favorite New Order song; "Leave Me Alone."

Personally I think Low-Life has it beat, but it's still a million times better than the dreck they would start releasing post 1989.

NOT CRAP

-Jeremy

I love this album! NC. I can't listen to New Order past maybe a few singles off Low-Life. NC!

placeholder wrote:

cesb wrote:The first single sounds like Joy Division (both songs wer JD songs) with somebody else singing - somebodyo besides Sumner too, I think...That single and much of Movement seem to have other band members singing...Steve Morris, maybe?

I'm pretty sure it's Bernard Sumner singing on "In a Lonely Place" and both New Order versions of "Ceremony" (with and without Gillian Gilbert). There were some demos recorded at Cabaret Voltaire's Western Works, and I think Stephen Morris might sing the version of "Ceremony" recorded then. The vocals sound strange on my bootleg copy of these songs, so it's a bit hard to tell.

Peter Hook sings "Dreams Never End" and "Doubts Even Here" on Movement, and Gillian Gilbert does some talking on the latter (which is my all-time favorite New Order song). I'm 99.9% certain Bernard Sumner sings the rest of the songs on Movement.

Sorry for this lengthy, nerdy post!

I'm a JD geek myself. Thanks for the minutia.

steve wrote:
I remember more clearly all the stuff I disliked:
*Linn Drum benching a fantastic and unique drummer.

Steve,watch the video "Pumped full of drugs"(1985).I bet you’ll like it.
It is a powerful live performance and Stephen Morris is simply fantastic.
I also recommend the live dvd "Finsbury park 9th june 02 new order 511".They have played a great set on this one(including 5 joy division songs).

242sumner wrote:

steve wrote:
I remember more clearly all the stuff I disliked:
*Linn Drum benching a fantastic and unique drummer.

Steve,watch the video "Pumped full of drugs"(1985).I bet you’ll like it.
It is a powerful live performance and Stephen Morris is simply fantastic.
I also recommend the live dvd "Finsbury park 9th june 02 new order 511".They have played a great set on this one(including 5 joy division songs).

I wouldn't recommend "Pumped full of drugs":although ""We all stand" sounds very good, the guitar is almost mute during the all set .

not at all crap, though of course not nearly as great as Movement...but espcially not crap are "Age of Consent," "Your Silent Face," and "Leave Me Alone" (and yeah, if you count "Blue Monday" as a bonus track...) and i agree with the aforementioned statement concerning how cringe-inducing those two loops on "5 8 6" (i recommending listening to the peel session version...recorded earlier when they were obsessed with dub and it's simply amazing...the album version's not terrible, but yeah, there's cheesy stuff (especially those loops) that detracts from the good...) and then there are the weaker tracks like "Ultraviolence" and "Ecstasy" that at least over the years i've come to like...

definitely a transition album...but they weren't quite to the point of club/dance band they quickly became...they did start using the sequencer as the main instrument on some of the songs, but in the case of "Your Silent Face" it's fucking amazing...and no one could argue Stephen Morris's god-like drummer status, but "Blue Monday" is a great use of drum machine too...

I love "Age of Consent." It would be hard for me to believe they recorded a better song than that.

The rest of the tracks on it are a bit spotty and the best of NO album I heard had some godawful dreck on it. Still I'd like to hear more by them.