Writing as a person who actually has mild autism (I have Aspberger's Syndrome), I can say from my own research that there is indeed no one specific cause for the variety of diagnoses, nor is there even agreement over the diagnoses or even a solid definition for many of them- AS for example. My opinion is that the syndromes covered under the umbrella term "autism" likely have a combination of causes which are genetic, environmental, conditioning-related and also personal (in that the personality of the given person is a determining factor). Hence I have my doubts as to whether heavy metals like mercury are the "aha!" factor.

clocker bob wrote:

Mercury is the second most toxic element on earth, second only to plutonium. The amount of mercury found in one mercury thermometer is enough to pollute a small lake.

Now, off to eat. Your gloating will last less than six hours, you last word obsessed maniac.

Bob, please cite the source for this

Additionally I think there's a danger of overestimating the importance of the toxicity of the element itself, as opposed to its compounds (which may or may not be hazardous or volatile in themselves.

Example: I love salt, I eat it a lot, too much in fact. However if I put a bit of sodium directly into my mouth I'd be immediately needing a few of those mercury amalgam fillings that used to be so popular. That is if the chlorine didn't kill me first.

So, salt: not as dangerous as Na or Cl individually, however, as a compound overconsumption is apparently hazardous.

vaild analogy?

fiery jack wrote:

clocker bob wrote:

Mercury is the second most toxic element on earth, second only to plutonium. The amount of mercury found in one mercury thermometer is enough to pollute a small lake.

Bob, please cite the source for this

Interesting that a google search of this phrase produces results almost exclusive to sites regarding autism. I couldn't find any source on these sites to back the claim.

If you edit the search to only include the 1st sentence, you get similar results, albeit with sites with additional ailments, none (that I saw) providing any evidence to the claim.

That being said, I don't see how it is important if it is 2nd, 5th or 90th. It is a dangerous metal that has the potential to cause a lot of harm.

Now, back to the Bob and Bizzaro Bob fight.

AlBStern wrote:That being said, I don't see how it is important if it is 2nd, 5th or 90th. It is a dangerous metal that has the potential to cause a lot of harm.

I agree (to some extent) - it's roughly what I said when that super grover chap was bandying his claims around earlier. Mercury doesn't have to be dangerous enough to drop an elelphant at a thousand yards for this discussion, so quit with the tabloid headlines bullshit. My other problem with that guy's assertions was that it indicated to me that he was unquestioningly appropriating any claim that fitted his argument, no matter how dubious, no checking. Plus it was pretty clear that he'd taken some of the info from a government report and hadn't even read the fucking introduction of the paper before using the stats incorrectly

There is another, more serious point behind it though (although this is pretty far from my field of expertise so I could be wrong) - if one is claiming that a specific mercury-based compound is dangerous, that's fine - but using other mercury-related dangers as evidence is a tricky area...otherwise I'd have to be careful using my $50 commemorative Slint cycling filter mask and diamond earring set, in case I got carbon monoxide poisoning

AlBStern wrote:Now, back to the Bob and Bizzaro Bob fight.

indeed... ladies, raise your handbags.

I learned this in Chemistry class: Metallic mercury is not toxic. Mercury salts have a wide range of toxicity, from not too bad to lethal in small doses. Mercury vapor is toxic.

So, don't hear "Mercury" and assume a pure environmental terror. Mineralized Mercury as cinnabar, for example, is essentially inert.

TobiasTheCommie wrote:

clocker bob wrote: TTC, what is the cause of autism? If you know it, why are they looking for it?

Ah, now you are asking me about something usefull, about time.

I explained that on page four. go there and search for "Etiology of autism".

Is that what you're referring to?

TTC on pg 4 wrote:In the recent years some of the myths regarding the etiology of autism have waned and been abandoned by the scientific community. Waned and been replaced with purely scientific causes.

Of course the research isn't complete yet, and there are probably more causes to be found in the future.

Talk about talking out of both sides of your mouth. First you lead with the word 'myths' ( your opinion ), and then you state your opinion that these 'myths' have been replaced with purely scientific causes.

TTC, that's a very broad term, and I hate to break this bad news to you, but you don't get to decide what gets placed into the myth category and what gets placed into the scientific causes category. Most people without an agenda like you would classify mercury poisoning as a potential scientific cause of neurological disorders, based on the fact that mercury poisoning is a known cause of other neurological disorders. Are you claiming that an environmental cause is not a scientific cause?

Then, because you know that the cause of autism has not been determined, you finish with this giant waffle:

TTC wrote:Of course the research isn't complete yet, and there are probably more causes to be found in the future.

Whoa there, TTC. Reads to me like a pretty clear statement of agreement with me: the cause of autism is an open question.

TTC, if Thimoseral is not a potential cause of neurological disorders, why was it removed from vaccines?

steve wrote:I learned this in Chemistry class: Metallic mercury is not toxic.

Metallic mercury is toxic. It is absorbed through the skin. Breaks up into fine particles to form a mist that can be inhaled.

here.

steve wrote:So, don't hear "Mercury" and assume a pure environmental terror. Mineralized Mercury as cinnabar, for example, is essentially inert.

Mercuric Sulphide or Cinnabar is highly toxic by ingestion or inhalation. May be fatal if ingested. May cause systemic effects. May cause serious CNS damage. Harmful by skin contact

here.

National Vaccine Information Center (NVIC) Says IOM Played Politics In Report On Autism And Vaccines

Washington, D.C. May 18, 2004 - The nation's largest and oldest parent-led vaccine safety organization is charging that today's report on autism and vaccines issued by the Institute of Medicine (IOM) seriously jeopardizes the credibility of IOM to make an objective scientific analysis of vaccine risks.

Read the whole new release here at nvic.org

Bob:

What's your point in bringing this issue up? Thimerosal has been removed from vaccines in the US if I'm not mistaken. What do you think should be done? Should vaccines be banned?

newberry wrote:Bob:

What's your point in bringing this issue up?

Love. I live to bring love and information.

newberry wrote: Thimerosal has been removed from vaccines in the US if I'm not mistaken.

It is Thimoseral, not thimerosal, right? I think I'm finally spelling it correctly.

Yes, Thimoseral has been removed ( took a couple Congressmen raising hell to make it happen ), and a rider has been inserted into the HSA to protect the pharm industry from lawsuits. Looks like damage control to me. Considering the pharmaceutical industry's long history of deceptive and slanted studies to protect profits, along with the Nazi pedigrees of the industry and the Nazi sympathies of our corporate fascist leadership, I would call this an issue not to be dropped.

newberry wrote:What do you think should be done? Should vaccines be banned?

I think vaccines should be subjected to honest testing. Personally, I'm very glad I got my shots before they cranked up the Thimoseral and raised the shot quantity to fifteen. I won't go near a flu shot and I've never had the flu in at least 20 years. From what I can tell, Thimoseral is still in some flu shots.