this is a no-brainer. rush limbaugh is awful.

You're right Steve. You're always right.

There should be no debate. Limited government shouldn't be considered. The federal government knows what is best for everyone. Uniform taxation isn't an option. Defense spending isn't an option. Open our borders, 100%. Universal healthcare for everyone, no other options. School vouchers are an attempt by the right to hijack the public school system and send all children to religious schools. Human life should be considered from when a person is old enough to say "hey I want to be alive" until they're so old they have to have someone else decide to kill them. Nothing else can be considered humane - just another attempt by the religious wingnuts to steal our country from us. Faith is for fools. Religion doubly so.

No one should even talk about these things. No reason to discuss.

Everyone who disagrees with you is just wrong. Fuck them all.

Thanks for clearing that up. And you're so kind about it too. Have a nice weekend in your myopic world.

unarmedman wrote:You're right Steve. You're always right.

There should be no debate. Limited government shouldn't be considered. The federal government knows what is best for everyone. Uniform taxation isn't an option. Defense spending isn't an option. Open our borders, 100%. Universal healthcare for everyone, no other options. School vouchers are an attempt by the right to hijack the public school system and send all children to religious schools. Human life should be considered from when a person is old enough to say "hey I want to be alive" until they're so old they have to have someone else decide to kill them. Nothing else can be considered humane - just another attempt by the religious wingnuts to steal our country from us. Faith is for fools. Religion doubly so.

No one should even talk about these things. No reason to discuss.

Everyone who disagrees with you is just wrong. Fuck them all.

Thanks for clearing that up. And you're so kind about it too. Have a nice weekend in your myopic world.

Settled then.

dbl post

unarmedman wrote:School vouchers are an attempt by the right to hijack the public school system and send all children to religious schools.

No it's actually a way for those who-already-can-afford private education (the rich SUV driving surburbanites that live in gated communities) to receive up to 6k in tax credits for sending each of their kids to private schools. While of course, penalizing "low performing" inner city schools by taking their funding away to pay the rich for these vouchers.

In the inner cities where Public Education is really a problem and the public has some illusion that vouchers are helpful, the "tax credit" doesn't really help the poor family trying to send their kids to a "better school" because 6k ain't shit to a low-income level family when a charter/voucher/private school costs upwards of 15k per year to attend.

unarmedman wrote:There should be no debate. Limited government shouldn't be considered.

How exactly has the last 6 years been an exercise in limited government? Have you actually read and understood any legislation passed in the last 6 years? Do you understand that federal spending across the board has incresed in 7 years?

unarmedman wrote:The federal government knows what is best for everyone.

Oh you mean like when to die, how to live, who you can fuck, where and when you can gamble and what you can and cannot ingest?

unarmedman wrote:Uniform taxation isn't an option.

You're god damned right it's not. Not for Bush and his tax cuts. Not for the oil and energy industry. Not for the drug industry. Not for the defense industry. But for everyone else? Sure. Everyone is equal but some are more equal then others. Regular folk who work their asses off just to try to meet monthly expenses? Equal. Big corporations and special interest groups that give humongeous piles of cash to political parties? More equal.

unarmedman wrote:Defense spending isn't an option.

Right because the poor defense industry hasn't made any money at all for the last 67 years. So many legitimate voices on the left are calling for a total end to defense spending. Perhaps you could help me out by listing all of those people? No? Why not?

unarmedman wrote: Open our borders, 100%.

Too late! ....

unarmedman wrote: Human life should be considered from when a person is old enough to say "hey I want to be alive" until they're so old they have to have someone else decide to kill them.

Just like how the Federal Government decided Terri Schiavo should keep her feeding tube. They know what's best for the individual.

unarmedman wrote: Faith is for fools. Religion doubly so.

That is actually correct. Score 1 point for yourself.

unarmedman wrote:No one should even talk about these things. No reason to discuss.

Everyone who disagrees with you is just wrong. Fuck them all.

Yeah how come this forum bans so many people that don't agree with Steve? Why are people here always keeping the poor white right wing man from making his case by using logic and reason against him? Enough I say!

unarmedman wrote: And you're so kind about it too.

Yeah Steve, why can't you be as nice to people as Rush is?

Wow El Protoolio, you got a bit worked up there.

You probably are responding on what you believe you can infer is my position on issues just from my argument, and bringing up those topics. But you really should ask me before arguing! Otherwise you might take a lot of time in an unnecessary response (like above!)

Trust me, I don't agree with many positions that are considered traditionally conservative. Some I do agree with. The current administration's application of its supposed "conservative" ideals has been quite flawed. You don't need to tell me that.

However, my sarcasm in my previous post is due to the fact that there are people out there that believe that conservative principles are 100% contrived out of disdain or animosity for portions of society. That they are 100% created for the control of America by the rich and pious. Last I checked most Democrats are pretty well off, and call themselves Christians as well. In other words, I don't think the faith has much to do with the politics.

Maybe you agree with this perspective, I don't know. Doesn't matter to me. But when Steve responds to me the way he did (and to anyone who disagrees with his politics, for that matter), I don't see him any differently than I see Rush. I just change the channel.

I guess today I decided to listen again. My mistake.

No it's actually a way for those who-already-can-afford private education (the rich SUV driving surburbanites that live in gated communities) to receive up to 6k in tax credits for sending each of their kids to private schools. While of course, penalizing "low performing" inner city schools by taking their funding away to pay the rich for these vouchers.

In the inner cities where Public Education is really a problem and the public has some illusion that vouchers are helpful, the "tax credit" doesn't really help the poor family trying to send their kids to a "better school" because 6k ain't shit to a low-income level family when a charter/voucher/private school costs upwards of 15k per year to attend.

I don't know about any other states than Florida that used the school voucher system. When I lived there it was the only one that did. Maybe this has changed. But it was nothing like what you described above.

The school had to have consecutive F ratings, and then you had to apply for the voucher. It almost entirely benefited the "inner cities" of Orlando, Miami, etc.

unarmedman wrote:There should be no debate. Limited government shouldn't be considered.

"Limited government" is not actually practiced by Republicans. Or do you call allocating hundreds of billions of dollars to the defense industry "limited government"? What right-wingers call "limited government" is the revocation of funds given to schools, roads, hospitals, lawyers, public-access radio and television, NEA, etc. They're fine taking away money from these groups, but don't think these guys are in favor of "limited government". Everyone who has read the Federalist Papers knows that "limited government" is a bad idea.

The federal government knows what is best for everyone.

You mean like those Congressmen who openly deride homosexuals, minorities and women, and who would like to see Intelligent Design taught in our public schools? Those members of the federal government? Last time I checked, Republicans were more in the business of telling people how to live their lives, not Democrats.

Uniform taxation isn't an option.

You're damn right it's not. At least not in any sane universe. A flat-tax would spell the end of what's left of our public infrastructure, and of all the benefits it provides. It would be a palpably greedy and even criminal maneuver.

Defense spending isn't an option.

Try not to set up straw men. No sane Democrat I know would be in favor of eradicating defense spending altogether. We're just in favor of a much more moderate approach, and a re-allocation of the enormous amount of funds claimed by the Pentagon to more beneficial social purposes. It's hard to justify spending fifty percent of my tax money on nuclear warheads when so many people can't get decent health care. Incredibly hard to justify. But I'm open to an argument to the contrary. The problem is that you people don't traffic in arguments; you traffic in facile name-calling and evasions of the debate.

Open our borders, 100%.

Again, don't set up straw men. Most Democrats are against this, though I am personally in favor of it. We fucked over Mexico's economy, so the least we owe its people is free access to American jobs.

Universal healthcare for everyone, no other options.

You mean just like every other major industrial society in the Western world? That kind of universal health care? Sounds like a good idea to me.

Faith is for fools. Religion doubly so.

Straw man alert! Straw man alert! Stop being a dummy!

No one should even talk about these things. No reason to discuss.

I'm in favor of discussion. Discuss, unarmedman, discuss! I'm right here! Try to debate my points, and I think you'll see that the majority of the EA posters will soundly hand you back your own posterior.

dbl post again!