Mr. Graham wrote:
Steve V.: No need to apologize! That would be like me apologizing to you for not taking your comment seriously. If you have anything to say besides "dude ur sucky," I'm all ears.

Okay.

You're a schmuck, too. What you did is fucking weak. You slowed down an already slow version of a song, and just did minor tweaks. Whooptie fucking doo doo hah hah. I apologized because I wasn't going to blow you and your "turntable prowess," even though I admire that you took the time to offer the music for harsh criticisms.

The Avalanches had a record years ago that was real interesting. I think it contained thousands and thousands of samples, and it was damn good. They are artists. The Books are a great band comprised of musicians and samples they use, and they make great records. There's other bands that use samples in their music, that I like and listen to often. But as far as their samples being instruments or whatever the fuck...still no.

Steve V. wrote:The Avalanches had a record years ago that was real interesting. I think it contained thousands and thousands of samples, and it was damn good. They are artists. The Books are a great band comprised of musicians and samples they use, and they make great records. There's other bands that use samples in their music, that I like and listen to often. But as far as their samples being instruments or whatever the fuck...still no.

That doesn't seem to hold together, logically.

X is a device
X can be used to make excellent music when applied with proper aesthetic sensitivity and technique
X is not an instrument?

The question becomes, what the fuck IS it, then?

Herring?

JDanger wrote:

Perfect.

Antero wrote:

Steve V. wrote:The Avalanches had a record years ago that was real interesting. I think it contained thousands and thousands of samples, and it was damn good. They are artists. The Books are a great band comprised of musicians and samples they use, and they make great records. There's other bands that use samples in their music, that I like and listen to often. But as far as their samples being instruments or whatever the fuck...still no.

That doesn't seem to hold together, logically.

X is a device
X can be used to make excellent music when applied with proper aesthetic sensitivity and technique
X is not an instrument?

The question becomes, what the fuck IS it, then?

Herring?

I'm still subscribing to this theory that if it plays prerecorded sound (meaning, sounds another band has already made and recorded), despite possible manipulation, it is not an instrument.

If you generate sound, and you like it, well, mission accomplished. I think it is as simple as that. Why is there a debate about the 'legitimacy' of this? If you like it, do it. If others don't like it, well, they don't have to listen to it.

I play and love 'rock', but I dick around with making noisy electronic 'music' as a solo hobby. It's fun. Discussions about the 'legitimacy' of sampling are weird...it is what it is.

Now, making money off of sampling what is obviously someone else's music...well, I think permission should be granted first, ideally. But that's a different issue.

I hated most hip hop-type stuff, but I like a lot of the 'chopped and screwed' aesthetic...mostly because I am a huge fan of damaged psychedelia.

later: hey, do you do requests? I would personally love to hear some edited Whitehouse...especially "I'm Coming Up Your Ass". Now, that would be fun...

Steve V. wrote: I'm still subscribing to this theory that if it plays prerecorded sound (meaning, sounds another band has already made and recorded), despite possible manipulation, it is not an instrument.

What if the particular "prerecorded sound" from another band was like from the guitarist's side project band? What if the drummer was also a part of that side project? (you know just helping him out, 'Hey man come down and do some beats for me.' 'Ok, sure brah.') So there is a 2/3 majority of members in the original band that also made the "prerecorded sound" in the side project band. Or what if mid-way through an album you change the name of your band? Can you sample your old band? What if you were cloned and your clone ended up being a 'prerecorded sound' Master. Like he was really famous. Could you sample your clone? Its basically the same as recording it yourself, right? You might get flak from people but you would be all, "Dude, it was my DNA that made this! I am the master copy! He came from me! I am the one who agreed to the experiments! I signed all the paperwork! I'm the one who had to endure all the stares and the whispering and the professor's glass eyeball! I am a man, not some kind of instrument! O God what have I done?! What have I become! I'm a MONSTER!

Steve V. wrote:I'm still subscribing to this theory that if it plays prerecorded sound (meaning, sounds another band has already made and recorded), despite possible manipulation, it is not an instrument.

I got that. I'm going to put aside mellotrons and sample-based keyboards (which is kind of obscuring the issue, rather than providing a counterexample, as their relationship to the user and to other works is entirely different). What I want to know, though, is if it is not an instrument, what IS it? It has to be something.

Possibilities:
A)

B)

C)


Seriously, though, I don't know what other word to use than "instrument," since the other words I have at my disposal don't seem to be able to express such its role.