Gramsci, you might want to have a look at this site:
download an interview with Richard Gage, AIA, ( American Institute of Architects ), discussing the demolition of the towers and WTC7

here's a .pdf of an analysis of the ridiculous simulations used by NIST to 'prove' that fires and gravity caused the demolitions, written by another architect, Eric Douglas

Why the Towers Fell: Two Theories
— William Rice, P.E. May 20, 2007

Civil/Structural Engineer Supports Controlled Demolition Theory

Having worked on structural steel buildings as a civil engineer in the era when the Twin Towers were designed and constructed, I found some disturbing discrepancies and omissions concerning their collapse on 9/11.

read the body of the Rice article here

Perhaps it is time for these and other unanswered questions surrounding 9/11 to be thoroughly investigated. Let’s start by contacting our congressional delegation.

William Rice, P.E., is a registered professional civil engineer who worked on structural steel (and concrete) buildings in Boston , New York , and Philadelphia . He was also a professor at Vermont Technical College where he taught engineering materials, structures lab, and other building related courses.

This is a picture of an exploding building. Small fires and gravity do not cause steel skyscrapers to explode.

Gravity cannot cause the concrete of a skyscraper to explode into clouds of fine dust.

Fire has never done this to steel. But a thermite incendiary cutter charge does. The byproduct of thermite is molten iron. The byproduct of thousands of thermite cutter charges is tons of molten iron — as witnessed by numerous NYFD personnel and the WTC Structural Engineer, Leslie Robertson.

"Many fireman know there were bombs in the building but they are afraid for their jobs to admit it because the higher-ups forbid discussion of this fact." ..... "I know 9/11 was an inside job. The police know it's an inside job and the firemen know it too."

Paul Isaac, FDNY

No steel framed high-rise building has ever collapsed due to fire — even though very large, very hot, and very long-lasting fires have ravaged them. These buildings are all in use today.

• Caracas, Venezuela, Oct, 2004, 56 story building,
• burned for 17 hours over 26 floors

• Los Angeles, May 1988, 1st Interstate Bank, 62 stories,
• burned for 3.5 hours over 5 floors

• Philadelphia, Feb, 1991, Meridian Plaza, 38 stories,
• burned for 18 hours over 8 floors

• New York, Aug, 1970, New York Plaza, 50 stories,
• burned for six hours

Previously molten metal was found "flowing like lava" by the FDNY in the basements of all 3 WTC High-rises. Hydrocarbon fires can burn at a maximum temperature of 1,800°F which is about 1,000° short of the beginning melting temperature of steel. Where did the molten metal come from? Why do FEMA and NIST deny its existence?

The 20 to 50 ton steel columns & beams were broken apart at welded connections and ejected laterally up to 500 feet.

The architectural drawings of the WTC North Tower have been leaked from an individual associated with the Silverstein-Weidlinger Report. They reveal that the large box columns of the core maintain their 30"x16" and 52"x22" dimensions at least up through the 66th floor. They also indicate that most of the core columns would be easily accessed from the elevator shafts in order to plant explosives. We know that the elevators were being modernized by Ace Elevator during the 9 months prior to 9/11.

This is the World Trade Center exploding.

This is an acknowledged explosion.
Can you tell the difference?

These angled cuts and the abundant previously molten slag are not typical of the demolition workers' oxy-acetylene torches used to cut the WTC steel. But they do indicate the typical angled technique of controlled demolition and the by-product of the incendiary cutting charge thermite (molten iron).

Which 20 story building will fall to the ground first? Until 9/11/01 most physicists would have agreed that the one that didn't have to crush though 100,000 tons of steel would fall first — at free-fall speed. On 9/11, the example on the left "collapsed" at virtually free-fall speed! But this could only have been accomplished by removing the columns ahead of the fall — with explosives.

Numerous Squibs (mis-timed explosions) can be seen seen 20 to 40 floors ahead of the advancing "collapse". NIST claims that they are "puffs of air" created from the pancaking floors above. But there are no pancaking floors above, they are not air but pulverized building materials, they occur precisely at the center of the building in an "open office plan", and finally they occur at over 100 feet per second — explosive speed!

The debris was equally distributed across a 1,400 ft. diameter. There are no "pancakes" stacked up at the bottom of either tower!

The FEMA report notes:
"The results of the examination are striking. They reveal a phenomenon never before observed in building fires: eutectic reactions, which caused "intergranular melting capable of turning a solid steel girder into Swiss cheese.... Evidence of a severe high temperature corrosion attack on the steel, including oxidation and sulfidation." NIST dropped this like a hot potato. These are all tell tell signs of the use of thermate (sulphur + thermite) incendiary cutter charges."

It takes thousands of degrees to bend steel like this without buckling. Thermate cutter charges create over 4,500°F. Fires — even with jet fuel — create only 1,700°F maximum.

The concrete and other building contents were pulverized to a thick ground hugging pyroclastic dust — much of which was <100 microns — the width of a human hair. The gravitational potential of the building at 100,000KWH does not account for the concrete pulverization or the rapid expansion of the dust clouds.

This is all that is left of the concrete floors, gypsum wall board, steel decking, office furniture, office machinery, filing cabinets. The toxic dust averages 4" deep — throughout lower Manhattan.

The people who signed this petition below are real Americans. Many of you need to take a long look at who you are.

TO THE MEMBERS OF THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES AND
OF THE SENATE OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

Please Take Notice That:

On Behalf of the People of the United States of America, the undersigned Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth and affiliates hereby petition for, and demand, a truly independent investigation with subpoena power in order to uncover the full truth surrounding the events of 9/11/01 - specifically the collapse of the World Trade Center Towers and Building 7. We believe that there is sufficient doubt about the official story and therefore that the 9/11 investigation must be re-opened and must include a full inquiry into the possible use of explosives that may have been the actual cause behind the destruction of the World Trade Center Towers and WTC Building 7.

Sincerely,

The Undersigned

Architects (Degreed & Licensed)

Architectural Professionals (Degreed)

Richard Gage, AIA, Architect
Walnut Creek, CA

Scott Page, M. Arch / Designer
Berkeley, CA

Don Gibbons, Architect
Pleasant Hill, CA

Jeffrey Tam, Architectural Professional
Oakland, CA

Jeff Arnold, Architect
Orinda, CA

Oscar Cisnero, Architectural Professional
Antioch, CA

John Cole, Architect
Walnut Creek, CA

Elwin Wong, Architectural Professional
Oakland, CA

David Crawford, Architect
Walnut Creek, CA

Henri Tso, Architectural Professional
Walnut Creek, CA

Haluk Akol, Architect & Structural Engineer
Lafayette, CA

Arthur Stopes, Planner
Berkeley, CA

John Eisenhart, Architect
San Diego, CA

Ken Huthcinson, Architectural Professional
Eugene, OR

Joe Bellows, Architect
Martinez, CA

Jan Leits, Architectural Professional
Berkeley, CA

John Howland, Architect
Walnut Creek, CA

Michael Reuter, Architectural Professional
Berkeley, CA

Eric Douglas, Architect
Howard Beach, NY

Chris Jung, Architectural Professional
Berkeley, CA

Peter Hendrickson, Architect
Santa Rosa, CA

Tim Clark, Architectural Professional
Albany, CA

Osvaldo Valdes, Architect
New York, NY

Jason Wilkinson, Architectural Professional
Berkeley, CA

Lily Livingston, Architect
Oakland, CA

Wendy Sitler, Designer
Berkeley, CA

Chris Swigert, Architect
Oakland, CA

Dominique Roddier, phD, Naval Architect
Berkeley, CA

Jim Bedinghaus, Architect
St. Petersburg, Florida

Karlene Gullone, Architectural Professional
San Francisco, CA

C. Bryan Phelps - AIA, Architect
Boulder, CO

Dave Heller, Architectural Professional
Berkeley, CA

Christian Mungenast AIA, Architect
Arlington, MA

Kurt Worthington, Urban Planner
San Francisco, CA

Engineers (Degreed & Licensed)

Engineering Professionals (Degreed)

Ken Kious, Electrical Engineer
Walnut Creek, CA

Gregg Brazel, BSCNE, Constr. Engr'g
Evanston, IL

J. Marx Ayres, PE, Mechanical Engineer
Santa Monica, CA

Ted Muga, BSCE, Civil Engineer
San Diego, CA

Robert Nielson, PLS, Land Surveyor
Walnut Creek, CA

Kevin Ryan, BS Chem., Certified Quality Engineer
Bloomington, IN

John F. Shanahan, PE, Electrical Engineer
Rancho Cucamonga, CA

Ken Jenkins, BS Carnegie Melon, Electrical Engineer
San Rafael, CA

Joseph Testa, P.E., Civil Engineer
Thousand Oaks, CA

John Shinn, phD., Chemical Engineer
Pleasant Hill, CA


John L Bursill, Licensed Aircraft Maintenance Engineer Avionics
Sydney, NSW

John Rexroat, Mfr. Engineer
Walnut Creek, CA

Nazareth "Blue" Lansing, Engineer
Houston, TX

Tony Szamboti, BS, Mechanical Engineering Professional
,
Dr. Michael Voschine, PhD., Structural Engineer
Miami, Florida

Doug Plumb, EE, Elecrical Engineering Professional
Toronto, ON

Rob Tamaki, M.A.Sc., P.Eng., Civil Engineer
Vancouver, BC

Christopher Backus, BS, Mechanical Engineering
Redmond, WA

Jasper Tomlinson MA(Oxon) CEnv MCIWEM, Environmental and Water Resources Engineer
London Uk, London

Jason Griffin, BS, Civil Engineer
Washington Dc,

Werner Planck, Engineering Consultant
Crystal Lake, ILL

Jay Easwaran, Ph.D. (Metallurgy & Materials Sci.), Metallurgical Engineer
Indianapolis, Indiana

Dr. P. S. Merkwurdiglieb, Chemical Engineer
Tampa, Florida

John Sotelo, BSME, MD, Mechanical Engineer
Eureka, CA

S. Drake, Electrical Engineer
Bear, DE

Ron Wilson, Engineering Staff
Fort Worth, Texas

Crystal, Mechanical Engineer
Seattle, WA

David Gregg Ph.D., Chemical Engineer
Moraga, California

James Brooks, B. Civil Eng, University of Texas, Engineering Consultant
Austin, TX

bob,

Just to play devil's advocate - hell I don't know if 9/11 was the result of an external or internal megalomaniac -

- Where do you source these photos from? You often use photographic evidence to support your case. Photos are very easy to edit, and similarities between images very easy to find. If someone posts a photo as evidence of the difference between the effects of fire and thermite cutters on steel, do you take their word that the image really does show what it claims to? Do you have a strong enough understanding of physics to be able to assess whether the photo is accurate or not yourself?

Also, do you ask yourself questions about the agenda that people speaking out against 9/11 might have? You're sure that those covering up 9/11 have an agenda - could it not equally be the case that those writing about how 9/11 was an inside job have their own agenda, are trying to fabricate their own lies to achieve their own goals?

simmo wrote:bob,

Simmo, the 9/11 truth movement is full of disinfo artists and government plants and flat out loonies. We have to navigate through them all. I've said this a number of times. It's a cheap shot by you to suggest that I make posts without doing my own research, especially when you offer no proof to the contrary.

All those photos are from the same site as the petition signed by the architects and engineers. If your reaction to that is to suggest that they are faked, then begin your attack on them. Those are the rules I have to operate under. If I dispute the official myth, I must present evidence.

It's all yours. The source for all the photos is visible if you look at the post in the quote page. Begin your investigation. Tell me that those aren't pics of the WTC or the steel or the dust. Good luck.

If it's full of crackpots, "disinfo artists" and "government plants," then there's no way you can possibly determine if any info they provide is true.

Therefore you can't trust any of those sources to provide reliable or accurate information.

Colonel Panic wrote:If it's full of crackpots, "disinfo artists" and "government plants," then there's no way you can possibly determine if any info they provide is true.

You idiot. Stating that there are disinfo artists in the truth movement is not the same as saying the truth movement is dominated by disinfo artists, you moron. Have you never heard of doing your own research, to determine what is to be believed and what isn't? Man, are you brainwashed.

Therefore you can't trust any of those sources to provide reliable or accurate information.

So fucking dumb. According to your deranged logic, the police would never be able to solve any criminal case, because it stands to reason that many of the people they talk to during their investigations will be lying to them. Evidence is judged apart from the messenger, you moron. A video of a tower turning to dust from ( allegedly ) small fires is pretty hard to fake, don't you think? Damn.

colonel panic wrote:Therefore you can't trust any of those sources to provide reliable or accurate information.

Right on, dude. Every engineer who backs the official myth is golden. Everyone who questions the myth is lying. Good logic, retard.

Thanks for my laugh of the day. Enjoy your final few years of hiding in the crowd of gutless cowards who back the official myth. Reckoning day is coming for all those who stood silent while this regime sent this country on a path to hell. Your conscience will come back to bite you soon.

Don't worry, dude, Bob is a certified throb-a-holic.

thanks for the informative post, clocker bob.

NerblyBear wrote:Don't worry, dude, Bob is a certified throb-a-holic.

This is hilarious, real witty stuff, you have a real talent.

Now can you tell us if you think Bob is wrong there, in his counter to Col. Panic, or not?

Colonel Panic wrote:If it's full of crackpots, "disinfo artists" and "government plants," then there's no way you can possibly determine if any info they provide is true.

Therefore you can't trust any of those sources to provide reliable or accurate information.

I hope you'll recognize that the government and media are also full of crackpots, "disinfo artists" and plants of whatever type. It would seem that you can't just automatically trust the whole of them either. Ditto the scientific community, the medical profession, auto-shops, women, men, and nature.

So who do you believe? Why believe anything? Why not use your eyes, ears, and brain to figure shit out yourself. At some point your own knowledge and time constraints will put real limits on what you can know and you will have take some things on faith. But your goal should be to "believe " as few things and few people as possible, unless your goal is to be ignorant.

Taking this approach to understand the events of 9/11 you immediately run into a problem. An incredible amount of evidence has been willfully destroyed, distorted, or withheld. You have no choice but to believe that certain things happened in a certain way because the proof is currently unavailable though it certainly exists, or did at one point.

For some people the amount of belief vs. actual information here is unacceptable. There is proof, let us see it. Let us investigate. There is no legitimate reason for withholding evidence, especially when you've been telling us the truth about everything all along.