There's no hoisting. How can there be hoisting when the petard waver has his fingers in his ears and is yelling "LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA"?

Pointless.

I'll start ignoring every single experience I've ever had with the police, and every single experience my family and many of my friends have ever had with the police....and every single experience countless others have had with the police....I'll stop reading the endless stories of corruption and brutality, I'll close my ears when I'm somewhere and I start to overhear cops talking their racist cop talk and laughing about beating people up...I'll forget the time the police kidnapped me and held me for ransom, and the time they robbed me of 11 dollars at gunpoint when I was a kid and the time they planted a bag of coke of my old drummer and sent him to prison and the time they beat my friend's gangbanger brother Joe up so bad he was in a coma and the time they tried to murder my father and the time they clubbed my mother and the time they did nothing at all but threaten her not to push the issue when a drunk cop ran a red light and totaled my sister's car, almost killing her and her kids....and the time they killed my mom's friend and her kid by chasing someone who tried to cash a bad 30 dollar check down 95th street at 100 miles an hour during the middle of the day...and the time the off duty cop who was a security guard at my high school dragged me into the bathroom and guarded the door while a bunch of gangbangers jumped me and also the several times a crime has been committed against me and they have either not shown up or when they did laughed at me for suggesting they actually try and do something about it or even ended up giving me a ticket for something stupid as punishment for wasting their valuable time on something so silly as a crime....and on and on and on and on....


Ok, I ignore every one of those things and start over with a clean slate, no preconceived notions of what cops are all about....you know what? I bet it takes a whole 2 days of being around them for me to hate them just as much as I do right now....

Every single cop I have ever dealt with has been a fucking prick.
How can I ignore that and force myself to believe that there are good ones out there? My experiences tell me there are NOT any good ones out there. It's part of the job, to be a prick. If you aren't a prick to begin with and you immerse yourself in the prick culture 8 hours a day guess what? You are gonna start taking on characteristics of a prick before too long.

I would be willing to put money on the fact a Chicago cop has never, ever once stopped and changed an old lady's flat tire.
Ticketed an old lady with a flat for having a disabled car on the side of the road? Had the car towed? Checked the car's various city stickers and whatnot to make sure they are up to date and ticketed her if they weren't?

Of course, but changed the tire out of sheer niceness in his black, cold cop heart?

pfffftttt

Yeah, and he flew away on a unicorn off to meet the Easter bunny for lunch afterwards.

I'd just like to say Salut! to zom-zom's dad.

He sounds like a thoroughly interesting and decent guy who did the best he could in the circumstances he was given. I highly doubt he was going around looking for heads to crack.

Second, I cant abide blanket statements about any group.

There are great people serving in our military even though there are soldiers who do things far worse than Marsupialized's stories about cops.

There are wonderful people that are police officers and I will still be first in line complaining about cops doing shitty things to people and trying to get changes made. Done it before and I will do it again. However, I can readily accept evidence contrary to the point that "police are bad" and place it into my understanding of the situation.

It's not black and white and it needs to stop being portrayed as such.

And finally, I don't think Ty was calling Marsupialized's position pointless, rather the act of arguing with him about it.

So Marsup, your dad accepted money to rough up hippies? And so did his friends?

That's pretty fucked up.

Wood Goblin wrote:So Marsup, your dad accepted money to rough up hippies? And so did his friends?

That's pretty fucked up.

My father was part of a small, local greaser type bike gang in the Oak Lawn area at the time, they were called the Barn Rats...if you look it up there's information about them online...anyhow, they had made a name for themselves in the area enough to where a few days before the convention several members of a well known nationwide biker gang rode up and said they had business to discuss and demanded a meeting with them.
At the meeting place, there were men who identified themselves as Chicago police officers in attendance.
They basically offered my dad's gang some cash and to help get the local police who they were having major problems with off their backs if they went down to the convention and started trouble, basically start beating hippies up and causing chaos so then the police would have reason to get involved and end the protests right away.
So they went. But as luck would have it, my dad met my hippie mom down there and ended up just hanging out with her and her friends all day and not beating anyone up. When the cops started beating people up, they ran away, but not before getting clubbed a few times on the way out.
8 years later I was born.

o_d_m wrote:There are great people serving in our military even though there are soldiers who do things far worse than Marsupialized's stories about cops.

Yes I know, I just said I can totally see where someone 'cool' would join the military.
On the other hand, there is no way on Earth someone 'cool' would ever become a police officer. It is the opposite of 'cool' in every way.
It's like someone intelligent becoming a born again Christian, it just could never happen, it's impossible.

Wood Goblin wrote:So Marsup, your dad accepted money to rough up hippies? And so did his friends?

That's pretty fucked up.

This isn't so fucked up. I mean for 1968. Nothing really happened in '68.

'67 was the summer of love. Some great albums got released. Some great shows got played. A lot of drugs.

1968- Presidential election-- Asshole republican vs. go-with-the-flow Democrat. May be some good sports. All that hippie shit got old fast. How long can you take hippies for?

'69--Great albums. I was born.

I do not like cops. They are the least-trustworthy group of people I have ever encountered. In the name of "freeing them up" to do their job, cops are granted the status of a special class of citizen. They can drive as fast as they want, flick their lights on for just a second if they don't feel like waiting at a red light at 3am, use and possess drugs and weapons without fear of imprisonment, beat you to a pulp if they see fit, ruin your life by planting evidence to have you jailed, and they can even kill you (Chicago police shoot a civilian on average once every 10 days). They then get to turn around and bully and punish others for doing many of those same things. If a cop wants to pull you over, they will. They don't need a reason. Cooked-up bullshit like "too fast for conditions," "loud muffler," "lane change without signaling" and a million other my-word-against-yours "offenses" allow cops to pull you over, fuck with you, and search your car and person (looking for further reasons to fuck with you) any time they feel like it. I have had cops lie right to my face about something I supposedly did because they wanted to pull me over and get a look-see inside my car. Cops are exempted from following the very system of laws they've been entrusted to enforce. And much like the clergy that habitually shield molesting priests from the accusations of non-clergy (another citizen vs. "special citizen" dynamic), cops tend to protect their own. "Once a cop, always a cop." It's like some insane club where you can legally carry a gun and fuck with others.

Talking about the rare "good" cop seems pointless. Replace the word cop with Crip when someone talks about the "good ones" to see just how irrelevant the statement sounds. Even if that person actually was a decent human being, he still chose to align himself with a fraternity of sociopaths, which says something about that individual. It's not just a job; fixing toilets is just a job. There's far more to it than that.

People sometimes justify all of this horrible behavior by saying that cops have such dangerous jobs, and therefore should be given a break...but the unsexy truth is that trash collectors have a higher incidence of injury and fatality on the job than cops. In fact, cops don't even make the top ten list of most dangerous occupations as reported by the Bureau of Labor Statistics...meanwhile trash collector is at #5.

Cops are not your friends. They are the grown-up Hall Monitors of the world.

Marsupialized wrote:...I'll forget the time the police kidnapped me and held me for ransom, and the time they robbed me of 11 dollars at gunpoint when I was a kid and the time they planted a bag of coke of my old drummer and sent him to prison and the time they beat my friend's gangbanger brother Joe up so bad he was in a coma and the time they tried to murder my father and the time they clubbed my mother and the time they did nothing at all but threaten her not to push the issue when a drunk cop ran a red light and totaled my sister's car, almost killing her and her kids....and the time they killed my mom's friend and her kid by chasing someone who tried to cash a bad 30 dollar check down 95th street at 100 miles an hour during the middle of the day...and the time the off duty cop who was a security guard at my high school dragged me into the bathroom and guarded the door while a bunch of gangbangers jumped me and also the several times a crime has been committed against me and they have either not shown up or when they did laughed at me for suggesting they actually try and do something about it or even ended up giving me a ticket for something stupid as punishment for wasting their valuable time on something so silly as a crime....and on and on and on and on....

Well no wonder you listen to Cocorosie!


Seriously though, fuck a bunch of cops. The good ones better get out while the getting is good.

[quote="Christopher"]Talking about the rare "good" cop seems pointless. Replace the word cop with Crip when someone talks about the "good ones" to see just how irrelevant the statement sounds. Even if that person actually was a decent human being, he still chose to align himself with a fraternity of sociopaths, which says something about that individual. It's not just a job; fixing toilets is just a job. There's far more to it than that.[quote]

I used to know a couple of guys who grew up in South Central LA, and were Crips. A lot of it had to do with the fact that that was the neighborhood they lived in, and that you were more or less just looking out for your neighborhood. One of them told me he was pretty much the nerd of the bunch and he was fine with, and they were fine with, not promoting him past lookout. But he was neighborhood so he was family, for better and for worse.

Oh well...generalize away...