I saw this when it came out in some district of Chicago as my one and only American Cinema-going experience. It was cheap night which equals tons of free popcorn and a packed house of people chatting on their phones.

honeyisfunny wrote:I saw this when it came out in some district of Chicago as my one and only American Cinema-going experience. It was cheap night which equals tons of free popcorn and a packed house of people chatting on their phones.

So you saw a Rock Horror-esque screening where in people try to act as stupid as the characters in the movie? Awesome!

LutherBlissett wrote:But mistaking a stupid movie for a smart one is dumb.

why can't it be both? why can't a totally dumb movie (which this obviously is), say some smart things?
why is the daily show the informative "news" show on television?
why is south park the most socially insightful show on television?

Idiocracy didn't say anything smart at all. It pointed out the obvious in a way that wasn't funny or insightful.

this movie was baaad I can't believe how many not craps this has. I'm really annoyed by dax sheppard. how did he come to fame, through jackass or something? that guy isn't funny.

scntfc wrote:why can't it be both? why can't a totally dumb movie (which this obviously is), say some smart things?

Name two. Give us two "smart things" this movie said. Keeping in mind "smart" implies a form of insight that is neither obvious nor simple.

scntfc wrote:why is south park the most socially insightful show on television?

Nevermind...

LutherBlissett wrote:Nevermind...

bravo! (i'm clapping very, very slowly right now).

i think you're overestimating your typical american "stupid mike judge comedy" viewer. in general, americans are fucking ignorant and completely oblivious to even the most basic commentary in idiocracy. using your definition of smart (has to show insight, can't be obvious or simple) in relation to that demographic then there's plenty of smarts to go around. i'd guess that 95% of americans have never even thought about how mainstream media and advertising dumbs down the populace, so that's "smart". obvious to me, obvious to you, but not obvious to most people. take that premise, couch it in a bunch of base, dumb, lowest common denominator humor, and maybe just maybe someone will 'get it'.

and if there is a show that you think deals more with contemporary social and political issues than south park, then i'd love to know what it is (i'm not doubting you, i'd really like to know). i don't even particularly like the show, but i give credit where credit is due...those dudes take on plenty of issues that no one else will touch with a ten foot pole (the issue of portrayal of muhammed comes to mind).

scntfc wrote:i think you're overestimating your typical american "stupid mike judge comedy" viewer. in general, americans are fucking ignorant and completely oblivious to even the most basic commentary in idiocracy. using your definition of smart (has to show insight, can't be obvious or simple) in relation to that demographic then there's plenty of smarts to go around. i'd guess that 95% of americans have never even thought about how mainstream media and advertising dumbs down the populace, so that's "smart". obvious to me, obvious to you, but not obvious to most people. take that premise, couch it in a bunch of base, dumb, lowest common denominator humor, and maybe just maybe someone will 'get it'.

So wait.

Your argument is that if you're stupid and ignorant, like the "average" American, Idiocracy is a smart movie. Think about that.

Your defense of the movie as having smart things to say: first) presumes the stupidity and ignorance of its viewers and second) leads you to dumb down our very conception of smart. On one hand you show disdain for Americans as "fucking ignorant and completely oblivious," and on the other, you use that homogeneous bloc of stupid/ignorant humanity as the reference point for intelligent satire.

That's not a very compelling case for Idiocracy's satirical panache. Even your defense of it has you making an argument which unwittingly dumbs down what it means to say something smart.

scntfc wrote:
and if there is a show that you think deals more with contemporary social and political issues than south park, then i'd love to know what it is (i'm not doubting you, i'd really like to know). i don't even particularly like the show, but i give credit where credit is due...those dudes take on plenty of issues that no one else will touch with a ten foot pole (the issue of portrayal of muhammed comes to mind).

I haven't seen South Park in a while, but I have it on reasonable authority that it blows. You ask for shows that deal with "more" issues than South Park, which is not the same thing as dealing more incisively, critically, thoughtfully, or engagingly with said issues. Maybe South Park has a lock on sheer breadth, but in my experience its treatment of pressing issues is uneven and often reactionary when not simply opportunistic, cynical, and puerile.

I hear The Wire was a biting and engaging indictment of contemporary capitalist society, but I haven't seen it. I'm not much of a TV person, but I know that if South Park is your benchmark for social critique you can do better. Likewise, if you think The Daily Show is the most informative news programming on television, you should spend more time at the margins. I like Stewart, to a degree, but he plays into a lot of cheap, ignorant BS himself.

LutherBlissett wrote:Your argument is that if you're stupid and ignorant, like the "average" American, Idiocracy is a smart movie.

i never said anything about idiocracy being a smart movie. its a dumb fucking movie...but its a dumb fucking movie with a point, and a point that many many people (who have never heard of democracy now, mediamatters, adbusters, et al) haven't been exposed to. hence, that point can be thought of as smart.

LutherBlissett wrote:satirical panache

again? why do you think i love this movie so much? the forum is "crap/not crap" not, "crap/bestthingi'veeverwitnessedinmyentirelifeandthereforepuregenius". all i posted that sent you off on your tear was that even a dumb movie just might have something to say.

btw your posts boring. be fucking funny! or something. i feel like i'm reading the comments to a daily kos post.

and the wire is awesome.

not crap