I'm building my first studio and wanted some advice on which tape machine I sould buy. I've got 2 option I'm considering at the moment. My first option is a 1987 Sony/MCI JH24 2" 24 track for $2500. My second option is an Otari MX70 1" 16 track for $1500. Both machines are in excellent condition with good heads, recent maintenance, fully functional, etc. I realize that the JH24 is going to blow the MX70 away soundwise, but the MX70 comes with an MRL tape, 3 reels of used 1" tape, and 3 brand new reels of 1" tape. The difference in price, plus the amount I would be saving not having to buy an MRL and tape to record on, would probably be almost $2000 that I could apply elsewhere in the studio (better console, more mics, etc). Another bonus to the MX70 would be that I'd only need a 16 channel console, instead of 24, which would also save me some money. On the downside, I would have less tracks to work with, more tape hiss, and smaller head room. I'm torn between the money and the sound quality. Since I'm just starting out, the MX70 doesn't sound like such a bad idea, but I don't want the sound quality to drive away potential clients. Anybody want to throw in their two cents?

Go for the JH. Might as well jump right the fuck in with both feets!

Good luck new studio owner.

(also I have a small penis so track count means a lot to me)

whichever you do, get a 24+ ch console. if you do go the 16tk route, it's likely only a matter of time before you want to do 24tk, and then you'll be faced with replacing both your recorder and console. john vanderslice gave me this advice a while ago - he said 'it's way more of a pain in the ass to install a new console than it is to install a new machine'. as i'm older now, i definitely see the wisdom in his advice.

i used to own an MX70 - great little machine. sure maybe the JH sounds better, not sure i'd categorize it as 'blowing away'. and as far as scaring off clients - the MX70 was a professional machine. it's going to soud better than going straight digital. i'm not really convinced there's much difference btw the 16 ch of open tracks on a 1" machine and 24 open tracks on a 2".

if you're recording on tape, there is hiss. it is also one thing i like about it. i hate it when audio fades to digital zero.

also, dont forget to factor in cableing/snakes. this is a significant chunk of change often overlooked.

i used my MX70 for probably 3-4 years before getting a 24 tk - it was a great "learner" machine to get more comfortable with tape.

also, if you're not philosophically opposed to it you can always use a 16tk for 1-15 off tape, then record additional tracks on the CPU as needed and sync the two together.

another case for a 24ch + console even if you go the 16tk route.

2" is 'the professional standard' but even so, i don't see reels moving btw studios like i suspect they once did. even when sessions start on tape it seems a lot are eventually getting dumped to CPU so they can play with the rest of the world or you can have your dance remix made or whatever. i

also think that these days, if someone is savvy enough to know they're looking for a studio with tape, the fact that they have tape is the seller, not the noisefloor of an MX70 vs JH. only nerds here would even know theres a difference.

the sound quality issue is actually the least difficult part of selling a waffling potential client on working on tape in my experience. everyone seems to think universally it's going to sound better [and they have no idea btw 1", 2" or whatever]. they waffle on whether or not they'll be able to fix thier mistakes or make endless tweaks in mixing or any other thing.

i've also seen younger bands coming in amazed that you can "punch in" parts on tape - they have it in thier head that it's like live to 2 track. yes, if you fuck up, we can just fix that one measure...

i do think the JH will sound better, but like you said - there are many other considerations in your situation. i don't think you'll be disappointed with either.

good luck!

Thanks for the info Nick. Did you use any kind of noise reduction with yours? Do you think if I were to invest in some Dolby SR units with the MX70, that the noise floor would be comparable to the JH24 without noise reduction? I think I could live with the smaller headroom and less tracks, but I'm most worried about the tape hiss.

Thanks,
Joe

blue_thunder wrote:I'm building my first studio and wanted some advice on which tape machine I sould buy. I've got 2 option I'm considering at the moment. My first option is a 1987 Sony/MCI JH24 2" 24 track for $2500. My second option is an Otari MX70 1" 16 track for $1500. Both machines are in excellent condition with good heads, recent maintenance, fully functional, etc. I realize that the JH24 is going to blow the MX70 away soundwise, but the MX70 comes with an MRL tape, 3 reels of used 1" tape, and 3 brand new reels of 1" tape. The difference in price, plus the amount I would be saving not having to buy an MRL and tape to record on, would probably be almost $2000 that I could apply elsewhere in the studio (better console, more mics, etc). Another bonus to the MX70 would be that I'd only need a 16 channel console, instead of 24, which would also save me some money. On the downside, I would have less tracks to work with, more tape hiss, and smaller head room. I'm torn between the money and the sound quality. Since I'm just starting out, the MX70 doesn't sound like such a bad idea, but I don't want the sound quality to drive away potential clients. Anybody want to throw in their two cents?

I would recommend the 24 track. You are going to spend money after buying either machine, so you might as well spend it on the machine you will never need to replace. Having the 24 track will allow you to be compatible with other studios, possibly taking on mixing or overdub projects at your place. That is a good price for a working 24 track. The MRL for it will be from $300-$500. You won't be buying tape to record with, the bands you are recording should, so that isn't much of a consideration.
The mx-70 isn't too much noisier than the jh-24. If you make sure the machine is set up right and record with good levels you should be fine for most things.

blue_thunder wrote:Thanks for the info Nick. Did you use any kind of noise reduction with yours? Do you think if I were to invest in some Dolby SR units with the MX70, that the noise floor would be comparable to the JH24 without noise reduction? I think I could live with the smaller headroom and less tracks, but I'm most worried about the tape hiss.

Thanks,
Joe

Now your talking crazy. Just get the JH.

otisroom wrote:

blue_thunder wrote:Thanks for the info Nick. Did you use any kind of noise reduction with yours? Do you think if I were to invest in some Dolby SR units with the MX70, that the noise floor would be comparable to the JH24 without noise reduction? I think I could live with the smaller headroom and less tracks, but I'm most worried about the tape hiss.

Thanks,
Joe

Now your talking crazy. Just get the JH.

i'm inclined to agree. and like greg said as long as the JH is also equally well performing.

i didn't use the NR w/my MX70. the seller tried to sell it to me but i flat out couldn't afford it at the time.

if you flat out can't afford everything going the JH route and are willing to live w/having to upgrade in a while - maybe only then go the MX70 route. i'd really only be recommending the MX70 as a stop-gap measure. and i certainly wouldn't recommend spending extra for NR when you could just be applying that cash to a 2".

really at the end of the day 2" is where you want to be and if you can make it all happen now do it now. i was just trying to say the MX70 is a nice machine and nothing to scoff at.

Now that I think about it, the NR route isn't cost effective at all. I was thinking that I could get away with just buying a couple of units for under $500 and using them as I record track by track, like you would an outboard preamp. I didn't think about the fact that I would need a seperate unit for each track in order to decode the NR on playback. So, that's out of the question.

I'm still thinking the MX70 may be a better chioce for me, as I'm on a pretty small budget. The more I spend on a tape machine, the less I have to spend on a console. I'm afraid that if I go with the JH24, I'll get stuck having to settle for some piece of shit console.

in the long run for a studio i would get the 24 tracks.

It may seems trivial now but with 24 tracks you have more recording possibilities if you don't mind to do the sync thing with the Otari.

Also, someone here could confirm, i've heard that there are a lot of spares for MCI around (at Mercenary Audio for example, no?). I don't know for Otari.

Ok, so I think I'm going to get the MX70 and a decent 24 channel console. That will get me by for a while and then I can save up for a 2" Studer, which is what I really want but can't afford right now. At that point, I can either hold on to the MX70 for demos and lower budget clients, or I can sell it and get my money back.