Dazey Diver presents: best of EA forums Double D Ed.

1
DazeyDiver wrote:I'm really excited by this and hope that there is some way I can contribute.


since we're running this place like a classroom. I'd like to issue the first assignment to you, Dazey Diver. I had figured out how I wanted your help two days ago.

You had mentioned in the "I'm leaving" thread in the G.D. G.D. that you wish there was a collection of best or most useful threads, and I've got a deadline by thursday that you can help me with.

I have started, in general discussion a "Dazey Diver presents: best of EA forums" thread.
you may have me retitle it for you, as it's your thread, I've just marked a placeholder.

I've asked people to post their favourite posts (theirs or others) to seed the project. I've added run joe run's excellent piece on cheap trick as a seed, too. it's my contribution.

here's how I suggest you run it:

every time, someone links a post, your job is to find a related piece of original content on this site that you like and send people there with a link. sort of like a kerbled footnote. the only limitations are that the original quote and the linked quote have to be original content this website has generated. there's a lot. you won't run out of material.


there will be an example in the thread. you have all the time in the world to make it grow. if people posting to this thread would like to help and add another best of post/link to things, please do so.


example:
seed post:

On Mon Jan 31, 2005 2:30 pm, run joe, run wrote:Cheap Trick: A Story

by run joe, run

One day me and my friends went to ATP it was the Shellac curated one we saw lots of good bands like Dead Moon and Plush and also Shellac. We had a very good time and also The Breeders played and lots of good bands. At the end of the three days we were very tired. The last bands to play were Cheap Trick and The Fall we tried to choose between them. Me and my friends had never listened to Cheap Trick only heard one or two songs and knew the silly man with the guitar and knew they had a very famous live album done in Japan. Some of my friends chose The Fall but me and some others chose Cheap Trick it was a real gamble but that is the one we chose.

The nice man from Shellac his name is Steve Albini he came onto the stage and told the audience he was not in Cheap Trick but he was proud to call them friends and his name was Steve. Then the band called Cheap Trick came on the stage and started playing songs and I liked the sound of it and went near the front to see the band better. I was close to the silly guitarist man and the singer and they played songs which I didn't know but when I heard them play the songs I thought that I knew them all already and that they sounded like classic famous songs that I loved straight away. Each song after the next seemed better and better and all with great choruses and then I started thinking the guitarist man is not really silly he just pretends to be silly like a funny clown but he is not silly when he plays the music on his guitar.

Then I realised that the man who was singing he was very good and his voice was a very good voice and he did not speak to the audience not even once because he was concentrating on the singing he was doing so much. I looked around me and saw that some people maybe thought the band was a silly rock band and were funny but they were enjoying it as well and some of the people liked it a lot. I stayed at the front and I realised that the band Cheap Trick were not silly and I started to feel strange like it was special. The guitarist man said the singer was his favourite singer in the world and the singer's name was Robin Zander and I looked at him and he was very sweaty and not saying a word to the audience still but singing as if they had told him he was going to die very soon and this might be his last ever time to sing.

I looked at the other men in the band and they were called Bun E. Carlos on the drums and Tom Petersen on the bass and the funny guitarist was called Rick Neilsen and he threw plectrums into the audience and I got some of them and when I watched the other men in the band playing the songs I thought maybe they had been told that this might also be their last concert so better make it a special one. But I was more looking at Robin Zander the man who was singing because I could tell he used to be a famous rock star on people's posters on their bedroom walls and now he was much older and maybe he once wanted to give up singing because he was older but instead decided to concentrate on the singing and get better and better at it as he got older. He was very sweaty and it didn't put him off and he was very exciting to watch and he didn't move around.

As I heard more and more songs in the concert I thought about how the band Cheap Trick had played big stadiums and had girls screaming at them and been very famous and probably had lots of drugs and other things like that but now they were here playing to some people who didn't know them or really care about them like I didn't know them and some of the people watching probably wanted to see The Fall instead. But they did not get sad and instead they played like they did not want to be anywhere else or be doing anything else in the whole world. The more I watched and listened the more I thought that maybe they were much better than a lot of bands I had seen before who were even much younger than them. I became lost in the power of the band and I think that maybe someone like a doctor or a powerful ghost told them that if they do not play the best concert they can possibly play they will not live anymore and the band Cheap Trick played the show at ATP as if it was for their lives.

Cheap Trick played for their lives and because they want to live and want to play rock music more than most other bands I had ever seen in my life. As I watched them I understood what true rock music was and it was maybe the best band playing a concert I have ever seen.

I have never seen a band give so much and I was in a daze afterwards and thankyou to the nice man Steve Albini and Shellac for asking them to play at the festival where I was I will never forget it. Some of my friends didn't like it but some of them said it was one of the best things they had ever seen and we couldn't really talk to eachother properly. Then we went home the end.


related link:
the cheap trick-in color rerecorded by steve albini thread is hilarious.


so good.



get it?


now go.
kerble is right.

Dazey Diver presents: best of EA forums Double D Ed.

3
Friends, I'll need your help on this one. Post your fave threads with links!

Here's one of mine:

On Sat Jan 29, 2005 6:35 pm, biznono wrote:I am so happy to read about the farting (not crap). Let me continue the degeneration with a sincere question for the music experts. The last time I was at the Electrical Audio I ate maybe fifteen of the hot dogs from the Hot Doug's. This made me seriously constipated. Very early in the morning one of the days we were there in the control room I finally had the urge to go to the bathroom. My condition was well known, so I eagerly announced to my brother and Albiz that I thought this was going to be "the one." I left, went to the bathroom, managed to produce a meager collection of pebbles, and came back into the control room. They asked me how things went, and for some reason all I could think of was the Styx record "Pieces of Eight," which I uttered. Maybe I said this because "eight" sounds like "ate" ("pieces of ate," she will make sense in a minute), but consciously I think I had in mind the coins.

Anyway, the three of us realized, I'm pretty sure at once, that Styx record titles and song names were all code words and phrases either for shit or the experience of trying to go to the bathroom. Witness:

"The Grand Illusion"

"Fooling Yourself"

"Kilroy was here"

"Cornerstone"

"Renegade"

"Come Sail Away"

"Paradise Theater"

"Babe"

etc.

We then quickly realized that many band names were code for the same thing. I don't want to spoil the fun, but you will see if you think about this (and have never thought about it before) that the list is endless. The bands run from the famous (e.g., The Rolling Stones) to the forgettable (e.g., The Firm).

My girlfriend was not impressed. But a few weeks ago, when we were in a record store, she held up a record and asked me, "is this a good one?"

The record was Steely Dan's third album, "Pretzel Logic."

So here is my question. It's maybe not so hard to find other band names and record and song titles that can take on this double meaning. You can do the same with Movies (Titanic) and TV shows (The 10,000 Pyramid). But was Styx's entire career built on the double entendre? The evidence seems a little startling.

First of all, Styx by itself is a homophone for "sticks," which is an unmistakable image. But beyond that I was just overwhelmed when earlier today I went to their website, styxworld.com. I had no idea. They have a record called "The Serpent is Rising." A live record called "Caught in the Act" (if you hate Styx as much as I do then their live act is by definition shit -- catching their stage act is virtually the same as walking into a bathroom and catching all five members sitting on toilets, taking shits.) There is also a compilation called "Rockers." The band never made rock music that most of us would recognize as such, so what else could this mean?
But consider some of the lesser known songs:
"Having a Ball"
"After you Leave Me"
"Midnight Ride"
"The Grand Finale"
"Why me"
"Boat on the River"
"Half Penny, Two Penny"
"Too Much Time on my Hands"
"Waiting for Our Time"
"Yes I Can"
"Heavy Water"
"Just Fell In"
"Kiss Your Ass Goodbye"
and for Christ's sake,
"Movement for the Common Man"

Coincidence? Maybe. I've named nearly two records of "material," but I'm admittedly being selective with the evidence, some of which by itself is unconvincing.

But this is what's so stunning. They have a song from "The Serpent is Rising" called "Plexiglas Toilet" -- curiously, the title is given in parentheses. The lyrics from the website, they speak for themselves:

(plexiglas toilet)

Don't sit on the Plexiglas toilet
Said the momma to her son
Wipe the butt clean with the paper
Make it nice for everyone
But don't sit down on the Plexiglas toilet yeah

A boy of 5 stands close to the toilet
Holds the lid up with one hand
Won't let go the lid for fear that
On his banana it will land
Don't sit down on the Plexiglas toilet yeah

Boy goes up he eats the enchilada
With the sauce that burns the heart
Family comes to visit family
momma says don't belch and fart

Don't sit on the Plexiglas toilet
Said the momma to her son
Wipe the butt clean with the paper
Make it nice for everyone
But don't sit down on the Plexiglas toilet yeah

Everybody Sing!

Don't sit on the Plexiglas toilet
Said the momma to her son
Wipe the butt clean with the paper
Make it nice for everyone
But don't sit down on the Plexiglas toilet yeah

Don't sit on the Plexiglas toilet
Said the momma to her son
Wipe the butt clean with the paper
Make it nice for everyone
But don't sit down on the Plexiglas toilet yeah


WTF! Was Styx all a big fucking joke? The music has always been laughably shitty, but WTF?

I now defer to the geniuses of this website. Please tell me that other bands can be made to seem as if they were trying to encode the same symbolism. Please, find a band for which the same can be said as convincingly, or tell me, yes, this is what Styx was all about -- to say, "Styx is shit" has always been both figuratively and literally true.

Biz


related link: King Shit of Fuck Mountain
kerble wrote:you talked smack, now you gotta pony up some tone, hoss.


myspace.com/majorbarger

Dazey Diver presents: best of EA forums Double D Ed.

6
dontfeartheringo wrote:
DazeyDiver wrote:There is also a compilation called "Rockers." The band never made rock music that most of us would recognize as such, so what else could this mean?


Image


Sorry to digress, but that is a nice fucking rocking chair. Sweet.

Oh and this thread should be a gold mine:
http://www.electrical.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=17231
EA HALL OF FAME
www.myspace.com/pissedplanet
www.myspace.com/hookerdraggerlives

Dazey Diver presents: best of EA forums Double D Ed.

8
The HOF is more for individual posts, rather than whole threads, I think.

The 'best thread' thread would ideally contain a representative cross-section of the best the PRF is capable of. For example, I'd propose including How to be a better guitar player

which contains this great advice from scott

scott wrote:
night_tools wrote:...does anyone else have any hot tips for a total novice?


These days, my line of thinking is that the single most important aspect of playing a stringed instrument, and one that it seems nobody ever really talks about, is to learn how to control the muting of strings. I think it's the number one most important thing, *especially* if you're playing with distortion. Chords that don't use every single string, chords that skip strings, these can be some awesome motherfuckers. But if you accidentally let that D string ring out while you're playing a B Major chord, it might kinda sound like ass. Learning to use a finger to fret a note on one string, and simultaneously prevent an adjacent string from ringing out, is really important (i think) if you wanna move beyond playing barre chords or open chords. Even power chords with the root on the 5th string, if your 6th string is ringing out, you may be destroying the integrity of what you're setting out to do.

This is a zillion times more crucial with bass, where any ringing string, if not deliberate, is likely to make your parts sound like serious butt.

Muting strings when you're not playing them. The sooner you get a handle on that, the better, I think.



Aside from that very direct suggestion, I would also recommend that any player of stringed instruments, starting right now, and for the rest of their life, do these general type of things:

Learn how the instrument works, physically. What happens if you fret a note directly between the two frets? How about if it's super-close to the lower of the two frets, or the higher one? How does this affect the sound? What happens if you pick closer to the bridge, or closer to the neck? What about if you change the angle at which you hold the pick? Is there a difference in sound between the tiny E string (the 1st string) when you play it open, versus the 5th fret on the 2nd string, versus the 9th fret on the 3rd string, versus the 14th fret on the 4th string, versus the 19th fret on the 5th string? How crucial is this to the sound of the note, even though they're all the exact same note?

Learn how the instrument works, electronically. What happens if you use just a neck pickup, or just a bridge pickup, or both at the same time? And what effect does the choice of spot where you're picking have when using one pickup or the other or both? What happens when you turn your tone knob all the way up, and volume almost all the way down, or tone all the way done and volume all the way up, and everything in between? When you physically tap the instrument, does that tapping sound come out of your amp? What about if you tap on the pickups directly? Is this something you wanna use as part of your playing, or something you wanna avoid, or is it not an issue at all with your particular instrument?

Learn how different gain settings affect your general sound. With low gain, if you play two notes together that are only one fret apart (i.e. an open B string and the 3rd or 5th fret on the G string), how does that sound? How about with tons of gain/distortion? What happens if you play open chords with a clean sound, versus a heavily distorted sound? What about if you play complex chords that are kinda dissonant, clean vs distorted? What effect does distortion have on sustain? How about feedback? Does your instrument produce feedback that is dependent on your physical distance from the amp, or it doesn't matter where you are it always squeals, or it never squeals no matter what?

Learn how picking dynamics and fret-hand finger pressure affect your sound. If you play really soft, or play really hard, do you hear a difference in the quality of the sound? What about the pitch? Plug in a tuner, and play an open string... play it super-softly, and super-hard... see any difference in the pitch showing up on the tuner? What about with fretted notes, if you fret them very softly, with a light touch, or if you crank down really hard? See a difference in pitch? How is that stuff gonna affect what you're doing, when you play? How about when you're tuning? If you pick softly while you tune, and then pick hard when you play, are you ever gonna actually be in tune?

I'm not telling you what happens here based on my experience, but these are the sorta things that over the years I've come to realize have a big effect on tone and in-tune-ness and whatnot.

A solid state amp might not exhibit a lot of difference in tone based on picking dynamics (or it might) and a tube amp might be more responsive to dynamics (or it might not). Who knows? Try them out, if you can. Take your instrument to a guitar store and try out an amp that's known for good distortion sounds, and see what happens if you pick really softly versus really hard, versus everything in between. Maybe with one amp, it makes no difference, but with another, it makes a huge difference. Learn the combination of your instrument, and your amp, and see how you can work it. Some day, you'll have a different guitar or different amp, and things will change. But always get to know the setup you're playing through, as well as you can.

This is the kinda stuff that I think is key. If you have an interest in learning every facet of the instrument, that's a great thing and it's gonna help you discover stuff. Approaching the instrument with an angle like, "what does this do, what does that do, how does this work, what does this affect" and all that, over time you'll learn *your* way of playing guitar. There may not be any universal rules about "always play using your fingertips on the strings, not the sides of your fingers", but there are general guidelines like that. You'll find them all over if you look for books or websites or whatnot, I suspect. But the most important thing may well be to just learn everything *your* way. Ask your own questions, and find your own answers.

And very importantly, keep a spirit of always challenging yourself, always learning new stuff, always trying something that you think "I can't do this" or "this is too hard" until you can eventually do it. And be patient with it. If you only ever stick with what you already know, and what you can already do, that might work for you just fine. Or, you might end up bored, or saying stuff like "I passed my musical peak X years ago", which is a damn shame. Some of the best and most rewarding songs, for me, are the ones where the first time I tried to play a part, I couldn't do it for shit. And after 50 times, I was more comfortable with it. And after 100 times it was easy, and there was a new challenge on the horizon. The way it is for you now, where it's maybe hard to do much of anything, or lots of stuff is difficult for you to do the way you'd like, that is something where in time you'll be able to play all kinda shit just like you'd like to. But if you always challenge yourself, and always have parts that bring you back to where you are in the beginning, where you are trying to do something you currently cannot do, that's gonna be really rewarding over time.

Contrary to what some people might suggest, I think there is *always* a new challenge on the horizon. Initially, the challenge is to play the fucking guitar at all, to get notes out of it, to play chords, to pick/strum rythmns. Maybe later the challenge is to find *new* chords or rythmns. New rythmns are something that I think damn near any guitarist would benefit from pursuing. For me, there was a point where simplifying was the new challenge. Learning to say the most with the fewest notes. And following that, revisiting trying to play faster, or slower, or more difficult, or whatever... There's always something you haven't done before, or something you can do better.

And some day, maybe you hit a point where you're all "been there, done that". And then you can go ahead and look for alternate tunings, ones that you find on the net that somebody else used, or just go ahead and make up your own. And at that point, just about every rut you've fallen into, chord-wise, it's out the window, and nothing at all works like you've come to take for granted. And you have to learn all new stuff, and you'll play chords you've never played before. And you'll hear new voicings. And then when you go back to a normal tuning, you can try and find ways to pull off those same voicings, or similar, and you'll find yourself playing chords you never played before.

It's a neverending journey, if you're lucky. A spirit of openness to learning new things, and asking new questions, that's key. And persistence, and patience.

Also, there's a thing I call "the curse of the guy who plays alone in his bedroom too much". He only plays alone, for years, and then when he tries to play with other people, in a band, he has a really hard time with it. First off, playing alone, he never learned to lock into someone else's rythmn. I think that's one of the most important things of being in a band, is for people to lock together. Second, when he's playing alone, if he duffs a part he's trying to play, he starts over from shortly before the duff, or he just skips a section or adds a section in. That can work in band, but usually doesn't. Something I think you can only learn by playing in a band, or playing along with a cd or whatever, is how to fuck something up, and jump right back in, locked in, as quickly as you can. You never learn that if you just play alone in your bedroom, playing along with nothing but your own mind.

Watch out for that, and don't let yourself become that guy. I've seen it with a few different people, friends and bandmates of mine over the years. Nip that shit in the bud, and play with other people as soon as you can, even if you're not totally comfortable with that situation, just do it with people you feel comfortable around in general. It's good news.

If playing is causing you anything more than a really mild physical pain, then you should probably stop. If it's a matter of establishing your callouses on your fingers, that just takes time, and you should just be prepared to rip the shit out of your fingertips for a good while, until they become rock hard. Everybody has to deal with that, including and especially bassists and drummers. Develop your callouses as quickly as you can, and that means playing until you rip your fingers up, and maybe they turn a little white, or a lot white, as they're ripped, and maybe they have dark lines from where the strings rub, or maybe they don't. But don't be afraid of that shit, and just keep on trucking through it. Maybe it takes a few weeks, or a few months, but eventually with regular playing, you get your callouses, and they fucking rule.

But if it's joint pain, or muscle pain, that's different. Figuring out the proper ergonomics for your playing, that's really, really, really, really, really, really, really important. This is your body, your ability to pick up a coffee cup, or to rub somebody's shoulders or whatnot. If you play with your instrument too low, you can waste your fret hand wrist. If you try and stretch your fingers on your fret hand more than they're ready for, you can pull a tendon or ligament or whatever the hell it is. Pushing your physical limits is a great thing, but do NOT overdo it when it comes to joints and tendons and shit. If you have any suspicion that you're hurting your limbs, you should study up on ergonomics and learn what positions are gonna be good for you and which ones aren't. There have to be resources for this, on the net or in paper print or whatnot, I'm sure, though I don't know what they are.

Believe it or not, the thickness of your pick, and in what position you hold your pick, and how tightly you grasp your pick, this can be a big deal. I have a friend who just discovered that if he plays bass with a lighter pick, his wrist doesn't flip out and hurt like it used to. He was all talking about how he needs to see a doctor, because the pain and cramping was getting out of control... and all it took was to try a little lighter pick, which he naturally found himself grasping less rigidly, and things got way better.

You're not gonna know all the answers to this stuff in any short amount of time, unless you're like some kinda superhuman or something. It takes time. Everything takes time. It's worth it. But if you keep it in you mind from early on, you'll find yourself developing really good habits, rather than bad ones. And after playing for years, the habits that you've developed can be very hard to change, as much of playing is just thoughtless muscle memory. It's the time you spend developing the techniques that determines what you do down the road, whether you know it or not. So the earlier you evaluate your pick technique, your fret technique, your use of pressure or force with each hand, the better you'll be down the road.

A lot of this stuff probably won't mean shit to you for months, if you've *just* started. I think the beginning for most of us was exactly what you've described... learning a couple/few chords, learning to play a song you know and like... that's very normal. Developing technique is something that you start doing from the very first moment, but I think people usually don't realize it until many months or even years down the road.

Playing guitar can be very, very fucking rewarding. If you can keep yourself unburdened with a sense of "I am no good" or "I am the best" or any of that shit, you'll be the better for it. Whether or not you're good or bad, if you wanna play guitar, you really want it, then that shit doesn't matter. I think I spent a good number of years thinking I sucked, comparing myself to my peers or even to famous rock musicians I liked... and eventually I said "who cares, I am as good as I am". It doesn't matter how you stack up to other people, it only matters how you stack up to your own potential. If you're always on a quest to achieve whatever is your greatest potential, then you are all set.

The only book I can recommend is "Zen Guitar", which is not about techniques or how to judo chop people's faces, so much as it is about what I'm getting at here, the spirit of your approach, and your attitude and your posture as a musician and artist. I read it through one time, probably 10 years ago, and though I can't quote any of it, I know I got a lot out of it, as a player and as a person. Highly recommended.


The opposite of that thread would probably be this one:
Fred Mangan guitars
arthur wrote:Don't cut it for work don't cut it to look normal, people who feel offended by your nearly-30-with-long-hair face should just fuck off.

Dazey Diver presents: best of EA forums Double D Ed.

10
Aheh...

The "Selling A Veleno" thread, now with guest star appearances...

Zom-Zom wrote:Fuck it, this got me back on.

To your credit Vincent, you were very nice to talk to on the phone. You know your Velenos and you made good conversation. You also were quite prompt with payment for the Veleno and I believe you were fair and honest with the value. We exchanged a couple of cordial emails. You were very happy with the guitar, and it was just as I described it. I was happy to get the funds. We agreed to split the shipping costs.

I felt good about selling it to you, the fact that you appreciate these instruments and would play it made it easier for me to sell it to you. I was very happy for a few days.

Next thing I know, you are emailing my work claiming that I am trying to commit fraud, by billing the shipping costs to you. I am attempting, through unsavoury methods, to squeeze another $100 out of you. After you had already paid me thousands of dollars. Of course it was the error of the shipping company. I contacted them immediately and the mistake was corrected. That did not satisfy you, nor did my honest explanation.

I'm not even going to go into The Strap Button Situation. You can address that if you like.

To end this, I offered to pay the entire shipping costs myself just to stop your annoying emails. Which is indeed what happened.

If I had the money you have, and the acting career, and the guitar collection, and the studio full of vintage gear, the last thing I would do with my time would be to go name-calling and self-promoting on Internet Message Boards. I hardly have any time to do this sort of thing myself anymore.

I have paid my taxes and medical bills though, and I was able to get an absolute steal on an all-original '64 Deluxe Reverb and a Guild Starfire IV. I'm already about $3000 ahead.

So thanks again for buying, and try not to be such a jerk.



and this entry in the Litte Details from your Day thread.

the article to which it linked...

The New York City Fashion Blog wrote:Little Girl Is Mean to Vincent Gallo at Anna Sui

All we are saaaay-ing, is give Vince a chance.
Listen, we know we've said a lot about Vincent Gallo that has been, shall we say, unflattering. But we can't help that we noticed this: At Anna Sui's show in the tents Wednesday afternoon, Gallo sat next to a little girl who spent most of the show leaning away from him and at one point held her invitation up between them. However, and here's the shocker, we felt bad seeing that. Because Gallo actually looked better than we've seen him in a while — his hair looked fairly clean and almost fluffy, he seemed somewhat rested, and he laughed amicably with reporters. Obviously, these compliments are all relative, but it still caught us by surprise. We hope this means we haven't gone soft; surely in a day or two we'll see him out and about flossing his teeth with someone's veins or something, and the Earth will resume spinning on its axis. But in the meantime, maybe someone — surely not us! — should give Vincent a hug?

Image


As I reported in the original entry... apparently Vince was smelling a bit off.
Redline wrote:Not Crap. The sound of death? The sound of FUN! ScrrreeEEEEEEE

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