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steve wrote:Here's a baseball one I gave bob in the van:

What is the highest number of pitches a batter can see in a single at-bat without swinging -- neither being called out nor being awarded first base? for this exercise, we will ignore the special case of a pitched ball hitting the bat on his shoulder and being called a foul ball.

That is, the batter enters the batter's box and doesn't swing -- what is the greatest number of pitches he can see in this at-bat without being called out or being awarded a first base?

Note: There is disagreement on the ultimate answer to this question, depending on one specific set of circumstances (on which I will elaborate later), but there is a general case that can be answered completely.

How many?



Seven

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Bradley R. Weissenberger wrote:Now! Here's another tour keeper-upper. Figure out the minimum number of pitches that a pitcher can throw and win a nine-inning baseball game. NOTE: The pitcher throws a complete game.


What happens if a pitcher makes a full pitching motion without delivering the ball? I couldn't glean from the official rules. If it's a ball (as an illegal pitch), then he could walk someone on that. If it's not, and the batter swings, perhaps he could strike out a batter this way without pitching, eh?

Also, to get zero, a batter can get out in a bunch of ways without a pitch being thrown. Same with a non-picked off runner on base. Between all of these many possibilities, you could have a varied and interesting game without any pitches being thrown at all.

Sorta.

= Justin

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steve wrote:Here's a baseball one I gave bob in the van:

What is the highest number of pitches a batter can see in a single at-bat without swinging -- neither being called out nor being awarded first base? for this exercise, we will ignore the special case of a pitched ball hitting the bat on his shoulder and being called a foul ball.

That is, the batter enters the batter's box and doesn't swing -- what is the greatest number of pitches he can see in this at-bat without being called out or being awarded a first base?

Note: There is disagreement on the ultimate answer to this question, depending on one specific set of circumstances (on which I will elaborate later), but there is a general case that can be answered completely.

How many?


i believe the answer is 11. batter comes up with runner on base and two outs. with full count (5 pitches), runner is picked off or caught stealing. next inning, batter comes back up to bat with 0-0 count. batter works full count again (5 more pitches). payoff pitch is dropped third strike (no swing). batter is not called out, catcher airmails throw into right field. batter may advance at own risk around the bases, hence he is not "called out" or "awarded first base." 11 pitches, one at-bat, and he gets charged with a strikeout.

Tricks of the Trade: Going on Tour

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thedishonestdon wrote:i believe the answer is 11. batter comes up with runner on base and two outs. with full count (5 pitches), runner is picked off or caught stealing. next inning, batter comes back up to bat with 0-0 count. batter works full count again (5 more pitches). payoff pitch is dropped third strike (no swing). batter is not called out, catcher airmails throw into right field. batter may advance at own risk around the bases, hence he is not "called out" or "awarded first base." 11 pitches, one at-bat, and he gets charged with a strikeout.


Then I say 13: Runner on first and 2 outs. The pitcher steps off the rubber, then quickly back on and pitches. This is a balk. Runner advances to second. Repeat. Two pitches down. Then proceed with your 11 pitch scenario, for a total of 13.
Why do you make it so scary to post here.

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thedishonestdon wrote:i don't think a balk counts as a pitch. would you be tempted to swing at a balk?


I'm not sure temptation to swing is required.
"A Pitch is a ball delivered to the batter by the pitcher." (Official Rules 2.00)

There are a few ways the pitcher can deliver the ball to the batter that are balks. (Official Rules 8.05(e),(f),(m)). I didn't see anything that says that these deliveries would not be considered pitches.

Rules.
Why do you make it so scary to post here.

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thedishonestdon wrote:
steve wrote:What is the highest number of pitches a batter can see in a single at-bat without swinging


i believe the answer is 11. batter comes up with runner on base and two outs. with full count (5 pitches), runner is picked off or caught stealing. next inning, batter comes back up to bat with 0-0 count. batter works full count again (5 more pitches). payoff pitch is dropped third strike (no swing). batter is not called out, catcher airmails throw into right field. batter may advance at own risk around the bases, hence he is not "called out" or "awarded first base." 11 pitches, one at-bat, and he gets charged with a strikeout.


I am having trouble seeing how your solution involves a "single" at-bat? Forgive me,because it has been many years since I played the baseballs. But that looks like two at-bats.
Rick Reuben wrote:You are dumber than week-old donuts.

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not two at-bats, because the first never officially ended. (an at-bat must end in an out, hit, fielder's choice, error, etc.) the runner makes the final out of the inning, not the batter; therefore, the batter comes to the plate to lead off the next inning with a clean count.

as per the rules of the balk:

Rule 8.05 wrote:If there is a runner, or runners, it is a balk when_ (a) The pitcher, while touching his plate, makes any motion naturally associated with his pitch and fails to make such delivery; If a left-handed or right-handed pitcher swings his free foot past the back edge of the pitcher's rubber, he is required to pitch to the batter except to throw to second base on a pick off play. (b) The pitcher, while touching his plate, feints a throw to first base and fails to complete the throw; (c) The pitcher, while touching his plate, fails to step directly toward a base before throwing to that base; Requires the pitcher, while touching his plate, to step directly toward a base before throwing to that base. If a pitcher turns or spins off of his free foot without actually stepping or if he turns his body and throws before stepping, it is a balk. A pitcher is to step directly toward a base before throwing to that base but does not require him to throw (except to first base only) because he steps. It is possible, with runners on first and third, for the pitcher to step toward third and not throw, merely to bluff the runner back to third; then seeing the runner on first start for second, turn and step toward and throw to first base. This is legal. However, if, with runners on first and third, the pitcher, while in contact with the rubber, steps toward third and then immediately and in practically the same motion "wheels" and throws to first base, it is obviously an attempt to deceive the runner at first base, and in such a move it is practically impossible to step directly toward first base before the throw to first base, and such a move shall be called a balk. Of course, if the pitcher steps off the rubber and then makes such a move, it is not a balk. (d) The pitcher, while touching his plate, throws, or feints a throw to an unoccupied base, except for the purpose of making a play; (e) The pitcher makes an illegal pitch; A quick pitch is an illegal pitch. Umpires will judge a quick pitch as one delivered before the batter is reasonably set in the batter's box. With runners on base the penalty is a balk; with no runners on base, it is a ball. The quick pitch is dangerous and should not be permitted. (f) The pitcher delivers the ball to the batter while he is not facing the batter; (g) The pitcher makes any motion naturally associated with his pitch while he is not touching the pitcher's plate; (h) The pitcher unnecessarily delays the game; (i) The pitcher, without having the ball, stands on or astride the pitcher's plate or while off the plate, he feints a pitch; (j) The pitcher, after coming to a legal pitching position, removes one hand from the ball other than in an actual pitch, or in throwing to a base; (k) The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally drops the ball; (l) The pitcher, while giving an intentional base on balls, pitches when the catcher is not in the catcher's box; (m)The pitcher delivers the pitch from Set Position without coming to a stop. PENALTY: The ball is dead, and each runner shall advance one base without liability to be put out, unless the batter reaches first on a hit, an error, a base on balls, a hit batter, or otherwise, and all other runners advance at least one base, in which case the play proceeds without reference to the balk. APPROVED RULING: In cases where a pitcher balks and throws wild, either to a base or to home plate, a runner or runners may advance beyond the base to which he is entitled at his own risk. APPROVED RULING: A runner who misses the first base to which he is advancing and who is called out on appeal shall be considered as having advanced one base for the purpose of this rule. Umpires should bear in mind that the purpose of the balk rule is to prevent the pitcher from deliberately deceiving the base runner. If there is doubt in the umpire's mind, the "intent" of the pitcher should govern. However, certain specifics should be borne in mind: (a) Straddling the pitcher's rubber without the ball is to be interpreted as intent to deceive and ruled a balk. (b) With a runner on first base the pitcher may make a complete turn, without hesitating toward first, and throw to second. This is not to be interpreted as throwing to an unoccupied base.


the ball is dead. no pitch unless the batter advances to first on the balk delivery. this is really no different than a batter calling time and a pitcher delivering the ball to the plate anyway. that does not count as a pitch either.

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ironyengine wrote:I am having trouble seeing how your solution involves a "single" at-bat? Forgive me,because it has been many years since I played the baseballs. But that looks like two at-bats.


Official Rules 6.04: "A batter has legally completed his time at bat when he is put out or becomes a runner."

I don't know how the statisticians count it, but it sounds to me like the rules say it's one at-bat.
Why do you make it so scary to post here.

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