jason from volo wrote: Mon Jul 26, 2021 7:49 am My friends think I'm absolutely nuts for making it a routine to check Fox News on a daily basis. Better to keep a pulse on what's going on in that world than ignoring it. Some of their non-hocus-pocus programming (Bret Baier, Neil Cavuto, Chris Wallace) still shows a little bias but is pretty decent and is definitely a different perspective than CNN or MSNBC.

I do it too. I've found that the Fox News website exhibits examples of journalistic integrity daily. They have writers who were willing to explain how the unvaccinated population is allowing a Covid resurgence, or when Trump was uttering countless falsehoods. Granted, these were nestled in between articles about some 90's actor's bikini bod, and the most scandalous thing about Hillary Clinton that no one would care about anymore and several dozen other crap articles.

I was also pleased to see CNN's top headline one day last week was about how Biden's townhall was riddled with misspoken statements, and exaggerations.

My best sources for reduced bias are The Hill (dead center), The Atlantic (slight left), and The Economist (slight right). I really liked Reuters and was bummed when they went for a subscription model with a paywall. I just can't bring myself to pay for online news. Maybe that's not great of me.

For profit television news has become intolerable and uninformative. It’s not a good way to consume information, but it can make for a good laugh, scream, or cry if you can get through a segment of it.

People who only consume information from the TV are pretty apparent once you get them talking about things. The bullet points and counter-arguments are super easy to spot.

Much as anything else, judge any platform at its worst, because that's where it's willing to go.

^Of course the daytime shows are more “news” oriented and the nighttime shit is outrage entertainment, that’s given. But each is pandering to an audience regardless of the format, and that pandering becomes more identifiable year over year, IMO.

jason from volo wrote: Mon Jul 26, 2021 9:19 am ^ Which is why I trust no one news source. They all have been wrong.

Any source can be, and at times is, wrong but in good faith. That's not really what their worst is.

American Gothic wrote: Mon Jul 26, 2021 9:57 am
You seem to be saying I must think as you do, or I am fronting, stupid, or sick somehow for maybe thinking differently.
My favorite youtube channel currently is Christian Death - Topic. Even the Valor stuff.

Not at all. I'm not 100% certain of my own argument about Israel because it's fucking complicated. It would be hard for anyone's point of view to match mine for those two reasons (uncertain, complicated). I'm just inferring a hardline Zionist angle based on the content you shared totally unprompted, which I do think is wrong, just as I think a 'death to Israel' angle is wrong. If I'm misreading you it might be partly my own biases about zealotry, and partly your deliberately vague language (people who hate people etc). Not once have you mentioned Hamas, Netenyahu, a 2 state solution, the US Embassy in Jerusalem, US financial support, the Gaza strip, Jewish settlements etc. There's a wide range of opinions a person could have on any of those, and I don't believe there's one right answer. What I bristle at is one dimensional propaganda.

Also, Christian Death is awesome. We're in agreement there.

jason from volo wrote: Mon Jul 26, 2021 11:17 am I recall you mentioning near the beginning of this thread that you thought that the Biden administration has been a fascinating mixed bag so far. I didn't directly say at the time, but I agree.

Any particular things you like or dislike so far?

I do like the fact that he is continuing to reach out to republicans, even if it might just be lip service. At the presidential level, words matter, sometimes even more than actions.

I don't know how much I like Biden as a politician, but I'm pretty sure if I ever got a chance to meet him that I would like him as a person.

Personally I find so many things to be both underrated, and overrated depending on who you're talking to. Biden is one of them. I have people in my life who think he's a godsend and others (both right and far left) who think he's pure garbage.

I'd love for more people to chime in on this because half a year in his scorecard is already complicated and people are so exhausted in the post-Trump presidential era that there's not as much talk these days in my neck of the woods.

The good:
- The child tax credit is the closest thing we've seen to a national experiment in universal basic income, and it's been the biggest reduction in child poverty our nation has seen in quite some time
- Much to the chagrin of the GOP, the stretching of the concept of infrastructure beyond bridges and roads addresses some of the basic human services stuff (childcare, internet access, healthcare) that makes an individual household, and our entire economy work. The unexpected audience to Sanders' policy ideas is refreshing, and could be another step to do more for Americans in poverty than anyone since FDR, should legislation be able to work through a political minefield, and moderates like Manchin, Sinema etc.
- He's been willing to take the inevitable backlash by pulling out of Afghanistan. Trump (rightly gasp) talked about doing it, but whoever finishes the exit is forever on the line for any bad thing the Taliban ever does, which shows political courage.

The mixed:
- Biden's administration has employed a more diverse set of professionals than any in history, and the official acknowledgement of days like Juneteenth is an important acknowledgement. That said, while police reform has been pushed to the back burner many activists are right in complaining about symbolic gestures, without hefty policy behind it. I respect that major legislation that helps people in poverty is a boost for POC, but the fact that they're disproportionately affected by a number of issues means that it would take much more targeted action to correct widespread inequality- riskier political moves like nationalizing and redefining the police force, as well as reparations.

The bad:
- I haven't seen much from him to show that talk of student loan forgiveness was anything more than talk borrowed from Warren and Sanders' platforms.
- His hawkish tendencies seem capable of initiating another foreign entanglement.
- He appears capable of deteriorating to the point of incomprehensibility by the end of his first term, with every indication that he's already planning on a second.

losthighway wrote: Mon Jul 26, 2021 11:50 am
- He's been willing to take the inevitable backlash by pulling out of Afghanistan. Trump (rightly gasp) talked about doing it, but whoever finishes the exit is forever on the line for any bad thing the Taliban ever does, which shows political courage.

This genuinely worries me. The US presence in Afghanistan feels like the closest thing to a stabilizing presence this region has seen since 1989. The local economy built up around Bagram AF Base is going to collapse with the departure of US troops, and the potential for chaos, violence, turbulence and despotic power grabs is already unfolding. It's always been a no-win situation, and I'm pretty far from anything remotely hawk-like in my take on involvement in foreign affairs, but it's arguable that life for the average person in Afghanistan just got measurably worse.

^ I think that's a totally reasonable response. It could be argued that whatever mess we caused is our responsibility. The hard part of that is it doesn't seem like circumstances would change, even if we stayed a century. Afghanistan has long been a difficult place, we certainly didn't make it any better.

American Gothic wrote: Mon Jul 26, 2021 5:34 pmHopefully the non Government/Academia employed lower Middle/Working classes (especially Asians and Hispanics and Blacks) will turn on the Democrats/Left.

Show us an alternative that offers more than dystopian whitewashed wet dreams and incompetent governance that disproportionately leads to worse outcomes for us than WASPs and we're all ears. Most of us only put up with the Democrats because they beat the alternatives. All the so-called "libertarians" want is to turn the United States into Mexico. Well, move to Mexico, then.

I want competent and less corrupt Americanism affirming and protecting governance

Like Grafton, NH?

not Global/Marxist/Elitist rule with all the spoilt/crybully
WOKE bullshit telling us we are stupid and incapable of doing for ourselves anymore or evil for wanting to.

"Some mean brown/gay/whatever people told me the mean thing I did to them was bad, that's basically slavery!"