Tom Wanderer wrote: Mon Jan 31, 2022 9:40 am Right, I gotcha on the warpyness. I'll give it a go.

Those American Vintage heads look good and the price is right. I emailed Bovid but I'm kind of expecting that those are going to be more than I'm looking to spend.

those bovid heads are probably a chunk of dough, yeah. I did notice theres a head in the background. Is that useable?

twelvepoint wrote: Mon Jan 31, 2022 9:49 am

Tom Wanderer wrote: Mon Jan 31, 2022 9:40 am Right, I gotcha on the warpyness. I'll give it a go.

Those American Vintage heads look good and the price is right. I emailed Bovid but I'm kind of expecting that those are going to be more than I'm looking to spend.

those bovid heads are probably a chunk of dough, yeah. I did notice theres a head in the background. Is that useable?

I doubt it. One of the heads was torn, the other had lots of ripple. It's probably original, which would make it 88 years old. I feel like I can't expect much out of that.

Also, he was using a Slingerland pedal with the Ludwig kit. I thought that was kind of interesting. I wonder if the shop person recommend it, if he tried both and liked it better or what.

Tom Wanderer wrote: Mon Jan 31, 2022 8:31 am
Recommendation for legs. It doesn't have any.

get these:

http://www.dwdrums.com/factoryaccessori ... E=dwsm2224

also, is that snare brass? it looks the business and brass snares from that era are hard to get as they usually fetch coin. Not suggesting you sell as you obviously have history with it.

pet fever detector wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 10:03 pm
get these:

Looks like just what I need! Thank you.

Yes, from what I can tell the snare is brass. I won't be parting with it, but I have been told that those can be valuable. I'm not really a drummer, but I've always thought it had a great sound.

Tom Wanderer wrote: Wed Feb 02, 2022 7:39 am

pet fever detector wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 10:03 pm
get these:

Looks like just what I need! Thank you.

Just a quick word on these: the clamp mech is die-cast. Do NOT over-tighten. They are much more brittle than steel and will crack and break. Just get them to a firm grip and be done.

If I had any mfg suggestions to improve them, it'd be to get some rubber between the clamps so you don't have to tighten quite so much - they make a cowbell holder too that uses the same clamping mechanism. It's great but I didn't tighten it enough and it came loose mid-set on me once...so next time I torqued it down more...and eventually it cracked and broke on me. So yeah, just like die-cast hoops are less flexible and a little more challenging to find the tuning sweet spot on a snare, these are less forgiving than steel parts.

I mean they're great and kinda the only game in town so I bought another pair...but they're far from perfect. It may just be me from years of shit hardware before memory locks & having to over-tighten all the stands to keep them from collapsing.

Hey- so sorry to be late to the party!

I kept trying to start writing answers to this and then getting interrupted at work.

I have stripped this sort of kick drum. I'd say knock the loose stuff off with a putty knife and then give it a light pass with Citristrip. Don't do that "paint it on and wrap it in saran wrap overnight" thing because you don't want it working its way down between the plies and potentially causing the drum to delaminate. The paint is just barely hanging on, looks like.

I'd say to then give it a pass with sandpaper, moving from coarse (200) to very fine (2000). Then a decent multipaint primer (if you're using colored lacquer) and some rattlecan lacquer (multiple LIGHT coats, watch for drips) and you should get something playable. If you want a high gloss finish, you could also do two coats of clear lacquer on top of a colored lacquer, or just do all clear. A drum this old will look nice with clear lacquer.

As for snare, there were two versions of Ludwig shells at the time they were making those brass drums. The collectible, high value one is the "two piece" brass shell. You can tell if it's two pieces by checking the top and bottom of the center bead on the inside of the shell. You will feel a seam there if it's two pieces. In that case, it's the same shell as the original Black Beauty shells. That's great news.

If it's one piece, that's not bad news, because those are fine sounding drums of good quality.

Heads: I had a drum from this era that was a really weird size. It was like a 25 inch head. Some manufacturers did this to force you to buy their calfskins. I'd take the shell to a music store and see if anything fits it before you order anything. Remo will actually make a custom head to fit your shell if you don't mind sending them the shell or exact specs. I just kept using the calf heads on mine.

If you find that the drum will take standard heads then roll with a Fiberskyn P3 reso on each side of the drum. These shells are basically the same shells they were making right up until 1977, so the same heads that sound good on '60s Ludwigs will sound great on this drum.

It looks like in one of the photos, I see a kick spike on one of the hoops. If you have two of those, that's what passed for "legs" back in the day. There are dudes who are looking for those old school legs for restoration and tribute projects. Ebay or Reverb! The clamp-on ones that were mentioned in this thread are great and I have used them on a bunch of drums.

I agree that wood glue and clamps can fix that hoop if it's just come apart at the scarf joint.

Thank you thank you thank you.

I love this place.

I'm hoping to glue the hoop and get started on the shell this weekend. I think I've still got some Citristrip. Leaning toward a clear lacquer finish at the moment. After I get the shell refinished, I plan to take it to Rockhaus. The owner is a friend who knows drums and he can help determine if a standard head will fit. That Fiberskyn sounds good to me.

Really appreciate the info regarding the snare construction. Next time I have the heads off, I'll investigate further.

Ah! Kick spikes! Yes, I have two. I thought those were remnants of a woodblock or cowbell mount (both of which this kit had at some point. I may actually still have the block and bell but the hardware is probably long gone). Kick spikes make way more sense. I might as well give them a try when I'm all finished.

Thanks DFTR!!

I have mid-70s Ludwigs that have wrap lifting up at the seams. The tone here makes it sound like a somewhat easy repair. Is it?

and if not, what does it do to the resale value?

The best glue for drum wrap (in my limited experience) has been Masters Cement, which is a cobbler's glue. It's temperature hardy and you can get it from any number of internet sources.

If you have a heat gun or a hair dryer, I recommend using it to get the wrap that is lifting somewhat pliant. It's just plastic.

The day before I glue, I like to get the curled-up edge super hot (don't set it on fire), and then dry clamp it so that it cools off in the correct position. Use a yard stick and C-clamps. This won't completely fix the curling, but it'll help.

The day you're gonna glue, give the shell and the part of the wrap that used to be under the old seam a light sanding and brush it out to get all of the old crap out of the way. Then put Master's Cement on both surfaces, wrap your yardstick in wax paper, and once the glue is tacky, stick it down and clamp it. It won't hurt anything at all to maybe reheat that edge again while the cement is curing a little. (Go fast if you live in a dry place. I live in Georgia, so things dry slowly down here)

Leave it clamped for a day or two. Clean up with a magic sponge thing.

I posted this on another thread, but it might come in handy here if anyone else decides to tear down a DW5000 pedal (DW3000 has the same assembly type and steps):

So, I didn't actually film the process because I couldn't find my stupid tripod, but here's a text version:

Every single part you need to do this conversion is at Drum Factory Direct online.

If you're doing this conversion: Heat the set screws with a hair dryer for about thirty seconds to loosen the Loc-Tite! Remove all four with a 3/32 allen key. Place them on your tabletop or work bench so that they'll go back into the same holes. One seems to be larger than the rest, or else I'm on crack.

Remove the set screw in the top of the spring cam, or what DW calls the "right side square stroke adjustment" cam. Set it aside in its own special place. It is also 3/32 but is a little longer than all of the set screws that go on the cast iron bass and that hold the hex bar in place.

The hardest part is when you get all the set screws out and you're like "So, what's keeping this thing together? Why can't I slide the hex bar out?"
The answer is "Force of habit and DW's Loc-Tite." You just need a rubber mallet and the blunt end of a punch- a couple of quick taps on the red part that sticks through the spring cam/square adjustment thing, and it's out!

The outer bushing and the smaller bearing on the non-spring (left) side will come flying out, then you'll have to ease the bearing and outer bushing out of the spring side (right). This may take some gentle poking with a flathead screwdriver.

Give everything a good cleaning. Clean the bearings with some sort of mild cleaner that will dry quickly like mineral spirits or acetone. You're just trying to get hardened grease out of there.

Then dry the bearings as best you can and let them sit for a while so that the cleaner can evaporate.

Then lube again with something that is NOT WD40. Use skateboard bearing lube if you can get. Bones Speed Cream or Bronson Speed Co. High Speed Ceramic Oil are good options.

If you have to replace the bearings, the spring side (right) bearing is larger, it's NOT a skateboard bearing, despite what I read on the internet. It's a 7/8" precision bearing:

https://www.drumfactorydirect.com/index ... ts_id=7685

The non-spring side (left) bearing is smaller, it's 3/4":
https://www.drumfactorydirect.com/index ... ts_id=7532

It goes back together in this order: The smaller bearing goes onto the end of the hex shaft first, then the lock nut, then fit the large bushing and the outer bushing on the spring side (right) and thread the hex rod into the left side.

Pushing it halfway through, thread your new cam onto the hex rod using the old scratch marks in the hex rod to tell you where to tighten it down. (I'll bet they're there!) Then thread on the beater hub and finish pushing the hex rod the rest of the way through the right side of the pedal.

Push the left side outer bushing in from the left, make sure everything's flush on both sides, put some Loc-Tite (the BLUE not the RED!!) on your set screws and put them back into place.

Put some Loc-Tite on your set screw that goes into the top of the spring cam. You might need to give the cam a little love tap too, to make it sit flat on end of the hex rod.

The nylon strap does not come with a washer, so I went out to the Magic Coffee Can in the garage that has a million screws and washers in it and grabbed one. I'd do the same if I were you. The one-hole side goes on the bottom of the pedal, then loop the four-hole end over the cam and figure out which hole you want to use and where the strap is most centered on the pedal, then tighten the set screw on the outside of the cam. Now loop the strap over the cam again and push the screw that holds it into place through the right hole and tighten it down. I used Loc-Tite on this, too, but you may decide not to.

The screw that comes with the strap has a wider flange than the one on the cam, so I put the one that came with the cam back into the Magic Coffee Can.

Tighten your strap down. Tighten your beater down. Pull the spring hook up over the spring rocker cam and that should be all you need to do!

If I find another donor DW5000 pedal, I may order a set of the 3/4 and 7/8 permanently lubricated bearings from McMaster Carr and see if they feel any better/faster/smoother.

The trade number on the smaller DW bearing is 626z, which means outside diameter of 19mm or 0.748031 (basically 3/4") and inside diameter of 6mm or 0.23622" (basically 1/4"). The sealed bearing part number for that at McMaster is 626-2Z (SKU 6153K26) $13.00 and the part number for the permanently lubricated sealed bearing is R4A-2RS (SKU 2342K184) $14.56

The trade number on the largerDW bearing is (I think) R6-2Z, which means outside diameter of 22.225mm or 0.875 (basically 7/8") and inside diameter of 9.525mm or 0.375" (basically 3/4"). The sealed bearing part number for that at McMaster is R6-2Z (SKU 6138K24) $12.83 and the part number for the permanently lubricated sealed bearing is R6-2RS (SKU 2342K185) $15.48

https://www.mcmaster.com/bearings/ball- ... -bearings/

Yes, it would add $30 (with shipping) to the cost, but who knows? I'm a firm believer in FAFO. It might make it the best pedal ever.

It turns out that the bearings in Iron Cobra pedals (which are what I use most of the time) are skateboard sized bearings, and there's a strap conversion (and direct drive conversion) for them, too:

https://www.acd-unlimited.at/english/on ... /upgrades/

I have an old IC that has played a thousand or more gigs and god knows how many practices. It may be my test case on all of this.