ErikG wrote: I do appreciate a conventionally fine singer, e.g. classic era Scott Walker.

An interesting example that kind of solidifies my stance. Sure, he can croon as well as any of the greats, but the reason people like us go back to him and not Engelbert Humperdinck or whatever is because the music (and yeah, lyrical content) is more interesting.

Vocals . My main music complaint (or praise) is usually how interesting I find the vocals. Doesn't have to be technically good/great but it does have to be captivating.

The music is close but still second.

It should come as no surprise to anyone that knows me that it's always "Music".

I don't want to have to listen to some narcissist sing about their goddamn feelings, or how great they and their ilk are. Always ruining what might be great music with their words and language.

Let's keep things abstract folks. "Oooh"s, "aaah"s and maybe even "zuzuzu"s are okay.

Music for me

But I would say bad vox can ruin good music way easier than the other way around for me.

I don't listen to Dino JR or SY because I don't like the music.

Fuck a cappella. Instrumental music is fine by me. I think that pretty much answers it.

At first I figured there's lots of songs I think are great where I'm not even sure what the words are, so there's that. And I like instrumental music. CASE CLOSED.

But I usually like music with singing more than without. And even instrumental music usually needs an instrument that takes on a vocal-like expression or else it can get a bit wallpapery. And nothing spoils a song worse than a bad vocal. But few things can elevate a song like a great vocal.

And what is more fundamental to music than singing? A capella singing isn't crap, it sustained humanity throughout our prehistory. It's not all Caravan of Love. I once saw a bunch of guys spontaneously bust out a haka in a pub to honour a friend who had died and that was every bit as thunderous as rock music.

And then I realise the question is flawed because the voice is music, so how can you talk about vox or music?

It's just that a vocal brings other things besides - social factors. A voice has words (perhaps). A solo voice is a specific person. Maybe it's somebody you don't like.

There's some musical artists I like who are principally concerned with words. But then, there's lots of songs I think are great where I'm not even sure what the words are.