Oh yeah, Sister=Not crap. More "rock" than the earlier albums but still with lots of cool guitar-parts that sound more "arranged" than earlier albums but still in the context of more "primal" songwriting that avoids both the progginess *and* pop-conventions of much of Daydream Nation. I always liked Sister more thogh Daydream... is probably objectively better...

Evol is my fave though from this era; I dig all the earlier albums too with the exception of "Bad moon rising" which I only like in spots

jakethesnake wrote: Sat May 20, 2023 11:59 am Anyway, I like the *sound* on "Dirty" more than the sound on "Goo" which gets tedious in a "shoegazer goes grunge" kind of way. The problem is the *songs*. Basically, all the songs where Kim was sounding like a constipated grandma on top of "Riot grrl" punk type tunes with self-consciously "dumb" lyrics like "Don't touch my breast/I'm just working at the desk" which works for a Bikini Kill but hrdly for a a 40 year old art critic. The thurston sung tunes were better and felt a bitless desperate/cynical but even there, it was as they were trying to sound "cool" in a different, more "contemporary" way than before and sounding kind of silly as a result-both 100% and Youth against fascism sounded superlame to me....

Yes, well put. Great production job by Vig, but serious "How do you do, fellow 90s kids" vibes for me - v. strange move when they should have been basking in the elder statespeople status they'd earned, yet they regressed big time to appeal w/alternateen marketplace norms. I attribute it to sheer laziness on their part. See also: Dinosaur Jr and Mudhoney's major label records.

M.H wrote: Sat May 20, 2023 4:48 pm

jakethesnake wrote: Sat May 20, 2023 11:59 am Anyway, I like the *sound* on "Dirty" more than the sound on "Goo" which gets tedious in a "shoegazer goes grunge" kind of way. The problem is the *songs*. Basically, all the songs where Kim was sounding like a constipated grandma on top of "Riot grrl" punk type tunes with self-consciously "dumb" lyrics like "Don't touch my breast/I'm just working at the desk" which works for a Bikini Kill but hrdly for a a 40 year old art critic. The thurston sung tunes were better and felt a bitless desperate/cynical but even there, it was as they were trying to sound "cool" in a different, more "contemporary" way than before and sounding kind of silly as a result-both 100% and Youth against fascism sounded superlame to me....

Yes, well put. Great production job by Vig, but serious "How do you do, fellow 90s kids" vibes for me - v. strange move when they should have been basking in the elder statespeople status they'd earned, yet they regressed big time to appeal w/alternateen marketplace norms. I attribute it to sheer laziness on their part. See also: Dinosaur Jr and Mudhoney's major label records.

I thought that Mudhoney’s first ML album, Piece of Cake, was fantastic. Similarly with the Jimmy Dale Gilmore colander and Five Dollar Bob’s Mock Cooter Stew. It was when they stopped working with Conrad UNO at Egg and event back to Jack Endino that things turned south for me. This coincided with Mark getting clean and returning to song writing duties. I have never been able to get into anything that they have done since then, and heaven knows I have tried. The line about “why don’t you blow your brains out too”, so obviously about Courtney (or at the very least would be understood by everyone to be so, but I am being very charitable here), was stupid, puerile, and irretrievably cruel. They were all old enough to know better, and they are not stupid. I cannot imagine what Frances Bean thinks or feels if she has heard this. I hope that she has not. Yes I know that they have claimed that the line is actually about Steve, but we all know that this is nonsense.

But they really were my favourite band for years.

The mixes on the last couple of albums have been very hard going. Spoken vocals super forward, resulting in everything else sounding like it is being played at conversational volumes. Very odd choices here but they are theirs to make of course.

Sister was the first SY record I bought, and it’s probably still my favorite though Daydream Nation is arguably my favorite on different days.

This is the album I always come back to when I think I’m ready to absolutely get into Sonic Youth.

I have never been able to shake that this band is really disingenuous. None of it sticks. I’ve been listening to them on and off for 20 years. I’ve owned their albums and made points to deep dive on their discography. I’ve NEVER been able to get past that it ALWAYS sounds really very, very empty. They’ve snuck in. They are considered as important as the bands they wish they were. How do you do fellow kids is their whole MO. I don’t know how they’ve done this!

I’m sorry. This is a terrible assertive personal opinion in bad taste. I just can’t with Sonic Youth.

Haydon wrote: Fri May 26, 2023 7:33 am This is the album I always come back to when I think I’m ready to absolutely get into Sonic Youth.

I have never been able to shake that this band is really disingenuous. None of it sticks. I’ve been listening to them on and off for 20 years. I’ve owned their albums and made points to deep dive on their discography. I’ve NEVER been able to get past that it ALWAYS sounds really very, very empty. They’ve snuck in. They are considered as important as the bands they wish they were. How do you do fellow kids is their whole MO. I don’t know how they’ve done this!

I’m sorry. This is a terrible assertive personal opinion in bad taste. I just can’t with Sonic Youth.

I like Sonic Youth but I have always agreed with Mark Prindle's quote about them: "They really are a very good band. They just need to edit their work a little better."
As for the disingenous thing, I definately felt that from the Kim/Thurston axis. It's not much surprise that the only post-SY work I really like is Lee Ronaldo's.

Sister is ok. Handfull of really good songs, others I skip.