Re: Speaker Cable rules of thumb

11
Garth wrote: Mon Jul 17, 2023 8:32 am lamp cord probably fine for guitar but at the risk of embarrassing myself I am wondering if it might be worth going with a higher gauge cable for say SVT > 8x10 or some other very high-powered bass rig since bass and volume are certainly two higher demand needs. I guess now that I think about it though, some of the bigger sound reinforcement rigs I've worked with are doing very long runs to subs w/ 12 gauge I believe...so I may have answered my own question in that it's probably overkill.
People generally overestimate the wire gauge required for high-power applications.

At the risk of Bishopdante-ing this thread, let's do some back-of-the napkin math.

Assume a bass amp putting out a constant 300 W RMS signal into a 4 ohm load (I'm not going to get into complex impedances and reactive elements here).
That's about 9 A continuous.

Most PVC-coated cables have a maximum temp rating of 160 F. Let's assume it's a warm club and the ambient temperature is 80 F. So we want to keep the cable below 80 F of temp rise.

A single 12 AWG stranded conductor has a resistance of about 0.002 ohms per foot. Let's assume 10 feet of TOTAL cable length (5 ft on each leg), as the SVT is sitting right on top of the fridge cab. That's 0.02 ohms.

Ohms law says we'll see 9^2 * 0.02 = 1.62 W of loss in the cable. Doesn't seem like that much.

Using this table, we can look up the temp rise (in deg C) vs. current:
Image


For 12 AWG the chart doesn't even go down to 9 A, which means no appreciable rise in temperature.

Going back to our 80 F (27 C) temp rise maximum from above, we'd need to use something like 20 AWG before we'd have to worry about the cable's rating.

So, for musical applications, where output is very dynamic and you're never putting out a constant 300 W, you can get away with 14 or 16 AWG lamp cord very easily.

Re: Speaker Cable rules of thumb

12
Garth wrote: Mon Jul 17, 2023 10:21 am now that I think about it, most larger speaker cable jacks might accommodate two strands of lamp cord doubled up. It might look a little wonky but if it's that much cheaper, that might be a good way to double the amount of copper or save someone from having to buy a spool of 14 or 12 awg & just use what you have lying around
Could just use Romex maybe?
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Re: Speaker Cable rules of thumb

13
Kniferide wrote: Mon Jul 17, 2023 10:44 am
Garth wrote: Mon Jul 17, 2023 10:21 am now that I think about it, most larger speaker cable jacks might accommodate two strands of lamp cord doubled up. It might look a little wonky but if it's that much cheaper, that might be a good way to double the amount of copper or save someone from having to buy a spool of 14 or 12 awg & just use what you have lying around
Could just use Romex maybe?
Romex is solid core. Bad idea.
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Re: Speaker Cable rules of thumb

15
My old bandmate had a good story about someone in his high school band frying an amp because they used a guitar cable instead of a speaker cable. Not sure if it was tube or solid state, but there' was definitely smoke. Before I knew much about gear, this definitely made me more aware of always using a speaker cable.

Aware I could roll my own, but I just buy Rattlesnake speaker cables at this point, and get them in a color I don't use for any of my guitar cables so it's super clear what is what.
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Re: Speaker Cable rules of thumb

16
tallchris wrote: Mon Jul 17, 2023 12:59 pm My old bandmate had a good story about someone in his high school band frying an amp because they used a guitar cable instead of a speaker cable. Not sure if it was tube or solid state, but there' was definitely smoke. Before I knew much about gear, this definitely made me more aware of always using a speaker cable.

Aware I could roll my own, but I just buy Rattlesnake speaker cables at this point, and get them in a color I don't use for any of my guitar cables so it's super clear what is what.
I have a friend/customer that killed an amp I built him by trying to put a PEDAL in between the amp and cab. Not sure what cables he was suing but who gives a shit at that point.

And yeah I just try and have non-round speaker cables (see lamp cord) so they can easily be differentiated from instrument cables.
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Re: Speaker Cable rules of thumb

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Dr Tony Balls wrote: Mon Jul 17, 2023 1:09 pm
I have a friend/customer that killed an amp I built him by trying to put a PEDAL in between the amp and cab. Not sure what cables he was suing but who gives a shit at that point.
Wait, that's NOT how pedals work?!?!?!

I kid, but curious, did this just fry the tubes or did this require replacing transformers or something?
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Re: Speaker Cable rules of thumb

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tallchris wrote: Mon Jul 17, 2023 1:12 pm
Dr Tony Balls wrote: Mon Jul 17, 2023 1:09 pm
I have a friend/customer that killed an amp I built him by trying to put a PEDAL in between the amp and cab. Not sure what cables he was suing but who gives a shit at that point.
Wait, that's NOT how pedals work?!?!?!

I kid, but curious, did this just fry the tubes or did this require replacing transformers or something?
I think it killed the OT. Cant fully remember.
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