losthighway wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 9:29 pm

Barbo wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 6:18 pm I like In Flames. But not bands that sound like In Flames. I have no interest in discovering them or giving them a chance. Just In Flames

I think for bands from their scene/locale I prefer At the Gates. As for this sound, hen I hear this song- especially the croon to croak to scream transition- I'd rather hear some heavy, latter day Deftones.

Oh man, At The Gates is so much better than this nu metal mom cut the crust off crap.




This is metal. I love how at the beginning Tomas looks like he's trying to take a hard heroin shit.

I don't know the In Flames catalog, but that video posted is a pile of synths and plug-ins with a singer who would probably be a DJ if he didn't have a band

ChudFusk wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 11:06 pm

Oh man, At The Gates is so much better than this nu metal mom cut the crust off crap.

Do you consider At The Gates death metal?

losthighway wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 11:55 pm

ChudFusk wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 11:06 pm

Oh man, At The Gates is so much better than this nu metal mom cut the crust off crap.

Do you consider At The Gates death metal?

It depends when you asked me that. In the late 80s / early 90s I might not have thought much about it and said "Yes." They're officially categorized as melodic death metal, but the labeling and codification of any genre doesn't happen until after its seminal period, and I think they're at a higher echelon than other bands who set out to be melodeath. My personal feel is that death metal needs to have primarily guttural and inhuman vocals, the riffs can't be too poppy, and the tempo should include some extreme variations. ATG breaks some of my rules because of Tomas' Swedish snarl, because the riffs are really catchy, and because the tempos go at a pretty consistent clip, more like NWOBHM or thrash. But the vocals are definitely inhuman if not deep, the riffs are so catchy that I can forgive them, and I like uptempo metal. I can't say Death isn't death metal, even though Chuck couldn't gurgle. Same with Deicide, but Glen does 3 kinds of voices so there's enough burp for my taste.

ChudFusk wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 11:06 pm I don't know the In Flames catalog, but that video posted is a pile of synths and plug-ins with a singer who would probably be a DJ if he didn't have a band

Just FYI - the early In Flames records (esp The Jester Race, which I guess is a low-level classic) basically took the Heartwork / Slaughter of the Soul business model and refined the ideas (Iron Maiden riffs in B standard tuning w/ hardcore energy) to max out the commercial potential of this formula.

See also the Haunted / Dark Tranquility / Arch Enemy etc.

I think this shit is very dull and safe, but there was something going on with that melo-death subgenre the late 90s. The 00s mersh metal cheese stuff these bands produced in their later career phase, not so much.

So maybe (?) check out Jester Race if you want to give them a fair trial (or see where a good portion of the Killswitch Engage blueprint was forged).

Went into a serious thrash metal phase round 94-96, classic and contemporary stuff. I loved me some Kreator. So there you go.

I prettty much enjoy all those subgenres in small doses... except for Black Metal. I always found it hilarious though that Burzum guy made some eerie and interesting stuff

Anodyne were noise metalcore or what? That Lifetime of grey skies record must be the heaviest thing on my collection.

I remember that At the gates track from a Metal Hammer comp. Cool.

M.H wrote: Sun Nov 19, 2023 4:35 am I think this shit is very dull and safe, but there was something going on with that melo-death subgenre the late 90s. The 00s mersh metal cheese stuff these bands produced in their later career phase, not so much.

I completely agree with this sentiment, and hate pretty much everything even remotely similar to the music In Flames makes. But there is something about their music, specifically Reroute to Remain and I, The Mask, that I thoroughly enjoy.

Jon

Vibracobra wrote: Sun Nov 19, 2023 5:03 am I prettty much enjoy all those subgenres in small doses... except for Black Metal. I always found it hilarious though that Burzum guy made some eerie and interesting stuff.

Yeah, Burzum* is a weird exception but I don't get the appeal of most black metal at all. Sloppy death metal that's not very heavy, but also with canned synth sounds and 'scary' cartoon vocals. Maybe it's all an elaborate joke? eg. J Foley's Valnoot parody.

*Bergraven strikes a similar note, but not nearly as lofi. Probably better as a person but that's the lowest bar..

Proto-metal, though it almost seems like cheating to include it.

And Burzum is fucking terrible. Emo for Nazis.

Burzum blows. Immortal was alright.

losthighway wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 11:55 pm

ChudFusk wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 11:06 pm

Oh man, At The Gates is so much better than this nu metal mom cut the crust off crap.

Do you consider At The Gates death metal?

EARLY At the Gates qith Alf Svensson as heard on the awesome first EP "Garden of grief" and the stellar "the Red in the sky is ours" (a top 3-5 swedeath album IMO; I don't get the complaints about messy songwriting-if anything, the songstructures are very much in line with where acts like Suffocation, Gorguts and-duh!-atheist were going in the same era:proggy and linear with *some* recurring sections/"hooks") definitely qualifies s deth metl and not overtly melodic death either.

The transitional "with fear..." is going more melodic in the riffage but I still wouldn't call it "melodeath" like In flames and co.

The studio songs on "Terminal spirit disease" is IMO the only full-on "melo-death" stuff they did. Meanwhile, the famous "Slaughter of the soul" is more retro-thrash/Slayer in its approach to rhythm and structures but obviously with the *riffs* associated with melodeath/gothenburg all over. Also, some Entombed styled death'n'roll in some sections but much slicker and less organic/loose... still, very different from In flames/Dark tranquility outside of *those* riffs... not the biggest fan of that album but it sure beats the numerous followers

Sorry for dorking out with the subgenres but hey, a question was asked...