the letter o wrote: Fri Jun 21, 2024 5:49 pm suddenly these self-same lichens (species of which are recognised indicators of air quality) are more sensitive to a one-time light dusting of coloured cornstarch, than they are to atmospheric changes related to hundreds of years of industrialisation. Convenient weaponised bullshit. Nothing more.

Exactly, right? You find yourself getting outraged about some cornstarch on a few rocks on the other side of the world, wonder why you aren't anywhere near as upset about massive, systematic environmental degradation happening on an industrial scale all around us, every single day.

The message isn’t the problem. If you don’t live in the UK it’s hard to fathom how absolutely awful the media here are, including the “good ones”.

Just look at the issue of Jeremy Corbyn’s leadership of the Labour Party, every goddam interview with a Labour politician… “Corbyn! How dare you Sir/Madam!!! HOW DARE YOU!!”

He’s not freaking Stalin, he’s just a centre left politician with some pacifist leanings. But evidently now he’s a monster. It blows me away.

This is the shit we have to deal with every day here.

Gramsci wrote: Sun Jun 23, 2024 5:52 am The message isn’t the problem. If you don’t live in the UK it’s hard to fathom how absolutely awful the media here are, including the “good ones”.

Just look at the issue of Jeremy Corbyn’s leadership of the Labour Party, every goddam interview with a Labour politician… “Corbyn! How dare you Sir/Madam!!! HOW DARE YOU!!”

He’s not freaking Stalin, he’s just a centre left politician with some pacifist leanings. But evidently now he’s a monster. It blows me away.

This is the shit we have to deal with every day here.

^ 1000%

Some of the furious reactions here surprise me. The whataboutery in some of the criticisms is a little crude (no pun intended).

You can't unwork what oil has brought us particularly easily. We need to travel, we need to eat, we need to take medicines. We can absolutely make better informed decisions about how we do those things, but it's naive to think we personally have the apparatus to remove it from our lives in its entirety. There's an uncomfortable class distinction in this too - some aspects of ethical living come at a price. Your local farmers' market isn't going to feed your family on a budget; an electric car isn't an option when all you can afford is a 15 year old run around; those Allbirds Tree Dashers are great but the 20 quid no brand means I get to eat for a couple of weeks. Personally, I'm fucking privileged in that I can afford to pay more for things that are generally less of a burden on the planet, but plenty aren't.

For the most part, JSO have engaged in non-destructive actions. Paints have been non-toxic, road blockages have merely been inconvenient. These things pale in comparison to the inconvenience of a rapidly deteriorating climate. We're seeing the effects of that right now, and our anger is being manipulated against entirely the wrong set of people. The 'theatrics' are central to the protests - collective complacency is marching us towards an inexorable future, so the kind of sanitised protest our governments would like us to engage in are futile. When you watch archive footage of white folk being asked about the direct action that came with the civil rights movement, it's interesting to hear similar counter-arguments: yeah, I don't got no problem with negroes but why do they have to block our businesses and block our roads? Protest isn't meant to be pretty.

The UK has seen some horrific actions by the state to delegitimise environmental organisations. They put agents deep inside activist organisations, some of whom sired children with unsuspecting partners, for decades. They've fed into a manufactured narrative about these organisations as being 'loony' and a threat to civil order. The UK has enacted some of the most draconian laws the country has ever seen to outlaw protest in recent years. The Public Order Act 2023 has effectively made criminals of dozens of protestors, with a number of them receiving custodial sentences. This should fucking terrify us all.

The government's behaviour is manifestly shortsighted. Crop failure, the increase in uninhabitable swathes of the planet, scarcity of natural resource, all of these things are likely to lead to unimaginable civil disorder as we fight for what's left. We're kicking the can down the road because we don't actually want to think about what we leave behind.

I support JSO. History will show that they were on the right side.

zzaaff wrote: Mon Jun 24, 2024 7:05 am
I support JSO. History will show that they were on the right side.

Their sentiment is clearly on the right side, but their performative actions / vandalism is pretty childish and IMO accomplish absolutely nothing to advance their goals. Nonconstructive activism is pointless and probably counter productive. I mean, it probably makes them feel better for "doing something", but thats about it.

zzaaff wrote: Mon Jun 24, 2024 7:05 amI support JSO. History will show that they were on the right side.

Same here. I fully agree with this entire post.

Liberals'/centrists'/conservatives' armchair policing of leftist activists/actions is going to age like milk.

NOT CRAP.

Kniferide wrote:
their performative actions / vandalism is pretty childish and IMO accomplish absolutely nothing to advance their goals. Nonconstructive activism is pointless and probably counter productive. I mean, it probably makes them feel better for "doing something", but thats about it.

I'm pretty sure it's their way of screaming in our faces to also do something.


Well said Zaf.

Tourist Tom was disappointed

Chicago dyes the river green every year for the snake saint.

Agree with/understand their motivations, not sure about the means.

I hear this sort of critique frequently: these visible but symbolic acts of protest are misguided and do more harm than good.

I never hear a second paragraph giving meaningfully specific examples of better methods.

Pithier: let’s hear your protest, cocksocket?