Vibracobra wrote: Sun Sep 15, 2024 3:41 am Mark of Cain's first album from 1989 is awesome.

Very true. The ones with Stanier are also pretty great. But that old stuff that’s got more post-punk going on is definitely Of This Parish.

I think the “seriousness” accusation is kind of off mark, but an easy observation at a surface level. They’re definitely serious music without taking themselves seriously as a group. There’s plenty of war stories with them and the Melvins, TJL, GvsBs etc that don’t indicate taking themselves that seriously. Also the “weird” tracks on Betty are a deliberate attempt to lean into that. There’s an interview with John somewhere where he recounts a photographer asking them to do a shoot doing pushups in a boxing ring. The band told him to fuck off and ended up doing that laughing hanging off a pipe photo instead. Also the “shorts and crew cuts” were kind of bit as well. There was definitely no band stylist but Page told me the vaguely downtown skateboarder aesthetic they dress as anyway was kind of locked in to not appear to look like hipsters or metalheads. As was the bright pink ESP.

I guess that by 1993 they've become maybe too chuggachugga or metalllesque for some people who were initially blown away by the noisy side of the band 3 years ago. Kinda understand it. Not talkin bout Seby specifically.

Funnily enough, although I get why Meantime is a landmark for metalheads and the main Helmet reference, it is probably my least favorite album of them. Still like it a lot though.

Spun Aftertaste again yesterday, after years. That production is unmatched in some aspects

Aftertaste is a record of that era that isn't quite like any other, and it's very divisive amongst people I know. Zero middle ground; I like it a lot.

I'm suddenly reminded of a time where back in my first year of college I accepted a classmate's invitation to dinner. While helping to peel potatoes he made a move on me. At that time I wasn't comfortable with myself and politely declined. He laughed and said something like "boy, I will turn you out!" First time hearing of being "turned out" and I knew exactly what he meant!

I like Helmet. Used to bang out "Sinatra" at a couple of DJ gigs. Don't know anything past Betty. They have a Guzzard connection which is rad. Voting NC.

Betty has a regular recurring slot in my bicycling listening.

NC

Breaking out the Helmet records for the first time in ages thanks to this thread. Abstaining from voting for now.

I still think about this stage banter from Page in this vid from 1997:

"Korn has been ever so kind to have us out for this month, and we're enjoying the company of Limp Bizkit as well. We have the gayest fucking orgy after every show, it's incredible. Sucking and butt-fucking, it's great, it's great."

chexmixbreath wrote: Mon Sep 16, 2024 7:00 am Breaking out the Helmet records for the first time in ages thanks to this thread. Abstaining from voting for now.

I still think about this stage banter from Page in this vid from 1997:

"Korn has been ever so kind to have us out for this month, and we're enjoying the company of Limp Bizkit as well. We have the gayest fucking orgy after every show, it's incredible. Sucking and butt-fucking, it's great, it's great."

Is this art vs artist in the context a shitty comment? There’s another clip online of Page bizarrely being questioned about the US army Don’t Ask Don’t Tell policy around the same time (it must have been in the news) and he makes pro LGBT rights comments. Which in the mid 90s wasn’t that common for a Rock Dude.

So shitty, puerile comments probably as a dig at the bands. An indication of him being a right wing dickhead, probably not based on all his other liberal and more recently anti Trump comments. But if that crosses a line for you, totally vote crap. Personally I tend avoid the Art vs Artist equation because most people do and say shitty things and I’d end up never enjoying anything.

Nah, I think about it in that it's so stupid and childish that it cracks me up sometimes. I was in high school when I first came across that bootleg. Nothing deeper than that. He's just goofing with a hostile crowd.

chexmixbreath wrote: Mon Sep 16, 2024 8:26 am Nah, I think about it in that it's so stupid and childish that it cracks me up sometimes. I was in high school when I first came across that bootleg. Nothing deeper than that. He's just goofing with a hostile crowd.

Ha. Here was me starting the eternal Art/Artist debate. Knowing Page as little as I do I’d assume the same. Deliberately riling people, especially the crowds as they became “jockier” was definitely a thing.

A_Man_Who_Tries wrote: Sun Sep 15, 2024 7:57 am Aftertaste is a record of that era that isn't quite like any other, and it's very divisive amongst people I know. Zero middle ground; I like it a lot.

Have you heard the initial David Sardy mixes? There’s a version of the album of an early mix, with a different track order. Same songs minus Renovation which was supposed to go on some film soundtrack.

It’s way rawer with different vocal takes. The album was delayed a year to do the re-rinse that ended up the final album.

I really like the album but there is one really big change that would have been fine as a one off, it’s the lyrics. There a sharp shift from kind of cut-up beat poetry to a mythical hate figure. They’re very direct and straightforward. Page was listening to a lot of Bowie around Betty and used the cut-up method on the lyrics. Which is why you have lines about mood rings and bad nutrition. Anyhoo, I preferred the opaqueness of the older lyrics but Stanier’s drumming on Aftertaste slaps. But when doesn’t it.