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C/NC: Gleeful reactions to horrible events happening to people we don't like

Crap-good riddance
Total votes: 7 (37%)
Not crap-shouldn't happen to anybody
Total votes: 7 (37%)
Who cares?
Total votes: 5 (26%)
Total votes: 19

Re: C/NC: Gleeful reactions to horrible events happening to people we don't like

151 by Curry Pervert
OrthodoxEaster wrote: Sun Dec 08, 2024 1:13 pm Thanks. And Jesus, I wouldn't mind having more faith in it myself. We agree on this 100%. Cheers.

Yeah, I think as a solution it should be fairly obvious it would be more effective, it's the enactment of it that's the biggest hurdle.


OrthodoxEaster wrote: Sun Dec 08, 2024 1:13 pm I never said I was confident, per se. (Uh, and if I did, that was dopey. Or I was a little drunk.) I'm just much more confident in it (and feeling it would be far more constructive) than let's-just-shoot-the-main-guy as a step towards solving a problem.

I don't think you came across as over confident here. The 'let's shoot the bad guys' option has a certain appeal which I understand, but as several people have mentioned, they just close ranks/build bigger walls/hire more security.
Dave N. wrote:Most of us are here because we’re trying to keep some spark of an idea from going out.

Re: C/NC: Gleeful reactions to horrible events happening to people we don't like

153 by OrthodoxEaster
Frankie99 wrote: Sun Dec 08, 2024 2:35 pm
OrthodoxEaster wrote: Sun Dec 08, 2024 1:06 pm
Frankie99 wrote: Sun Dec 08, 2024 12:59 pm I'm saying the actions that preceded the state violence don't matter. You're looking at this from a strict historical "a preceded b preceded c therefore x" and that's not what I'm challenging. I'm saying the path would have been taken no matter what. It was there all along, just waiting for an event. 9/11 happened to be that event.
But there is very much a direct causality and correlation there.

It's weird to say, oh well, something else kinda sorta along those same lines would have happened anyway.

And—apologies if I'm reading you wrong—use that as a means to justify (?) public assassinations or terrorist attacks on targets you don't like. Which, historically, seem to fail to accomplish much (if untethered from broader and arguably way more effective social and economic actions), over and over.

Sorry if this sounds blunt, but so what? At best, nobody solves anything either way.
I can't make you get it, but you're not getting it. And you're mistaking things I'm saying completely because you want me to be saying something I'm not.

The state will use its power against the powerless. End.

You're dressing this up with a barrage of events that wind up causing the state to use violence and power. I'm saying these 2 things: You're right these these events happened and were related, AND you're wrong that one cause the other. The state is the cause, not the events.
You say tomato...

Re: C/NC: Gleeful reactions to horrible events happening to people we don't like

155 by Frankie99
OrthodoxEaster wrote: Sun Dec 08, 2024 3:35 pm
Frankie99 wrote: Sun Dec 08, 2024 2:35 pm
OrthodoxEaster wrote: Sun Dec 08, 2024 1:06 pm

But there is very much a direct causality and correlation there.

It's weird to say, oh well, something else kinda sorta along those same lines would have happened anyway.

And—apologies if I'm reading you wrong—use that as a means to justify (?) public assassinations or terrorist attacks on targets you don't like. Which, historically, seem to fail to accomplish much (if untethered from broader and arguably way more effective social and economic actions), over and over.

Sorry if this sounds blunt, but so what? At best, nobody solves anything either way.
I can't make you get it, but you're not getting it. And you're mistaking things I'm saying completely because you want me to be saying something I'm not.

The state will use its power against the powerless. End.

You're dressing this up with a barrage of events that wind up causing the state to use violence and power. I'm saying these 2 things: You're right these these events happened and were related, AND you're wrong that one cause the other. The state is the cause, not the events.
You say tomato...
The problem is you are saying if not for this very specific series of events this one tomato would have never grown. I’m saying the tomato was always there.

Re: C/NC: Gleeful reactions to horrible events happening to people we don't like

156 by kicker_of_elves
It probably goes without saying that the narcissism inherent in vigilantism is problematic at best. Not that there isn't an equal level of narcissism bordering on sociopathy in the world of CEOs who view living breathing people as plotted points on a P/L statement, but the singular act of this shooting (and others, of course) and the subsequent celebration of it and what this means for our collective conscious is what is at the core of what really bothers me about it, and the reason for the poll/topic. Maybe the whole "take the high road" style argument is childlike and naive. I enjoyed reading through all the discussion this morning. My takeaway is that it's just sort of sad all around. Our health care system is FUBAR and ultimately only serves to fatten the bellies of the pigs who exploit us, and that exploitation has led us to the point where we are not simply desensitized to a very public execution style murder, but cheering for it and celebrating the murderer. I'm probably just rehashing my own point and not really contributing anything new to the argument, but I guess that's just where I'm at.

Re: C/NC: Gleeful reactions to horrible events happening to people we don't like

159 by DaveA
I think what people have trouble admitting is that tactics that have worked in some situations won’t work in others.

Take any approach . . .

-Turning the other cheek
-Complaining online
-Cyberbullying
-Writing letters to your congressman
-Petitions
-Lobbying
-Protesting
-Sit-ins
-Voting
-Vandalism
-Harassment
-Hunger strikes
-Sanctions
-Rioting
-Targeting select people with violence
-Staging coups
-Wars
-Terrorist attacks

. . . and on and on.

You could likely find examples of each of these things above affecting political change, as well as counter-examples of each of them being ineffective, even causing the pendulum to swing in the opposite direction. There’s also a distinction to be made between incremental, piecemeal victories, and long-lasting/net positives. And the latter can be undone, sometimes within a generation or so, bringing us all back to square one (or worse!). Yay, the march of history.


Anyway, it looks like they’ve caught the guy, just arrested in Altoona.

Edit: Bring on the Nintendo/Luigi memes.
ZzzZzzZzzz . . .

New Novel.
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