The Dems are doing their job exactly as intended at the moment folks.

Gramsci wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 8:17 am The Dems are doing their job exactly as intended at the moment folks.

100%

All I have heard and read from Democrats over the years about enacting substantive change is that it needs to be done incrementally so we don't shake the foundation, turn moderates off, and other weak reasoning; now look at the party, feckless, doing fuck all in response to an unelected billionaire bulldozing his way through the government

I'm expecting the suspension of the first amendment any week now. With all of the mass protests happening this week bad actors will instigate violence and Hegseth will get to do the job he was hired to do: use the US military to silence Americans for exercising their right to free speech.

Is this what John O’Patmos was referring to?

The worst thing about the pause of tariffs against Mexico is it makes Trump look tough and acting in US interests. In the context of the Dems, it makes them seem even more weak and ineffectual than they already are.

rsmurphy wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 9:29 am All I have heard and read from Democrats over the years about enacting substantive change is that it needs to be done incrementally so we don't shake the foundation, turn moderates off, and other weak reasoning

I think this line has always been bullshit. They just wanted their money and jobs (ie, campaign funds to keep flowing, re-election). Bernie Sanders could have beat Trump in 2020, but the party (read: all industries) didn't want him as president....IMO.

Gramsci wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 10:38 am The worst thing about the pause of tariffs against Mexico is it makes Trump look tough and acting in US interests. In the context of the Dems, it makes them seem even more weak and ineffectual than they already are.

To Trump supporters, sure. But for anyone with a brain, Mexico sent 10,000 troops to the border in 2021 at the behest of Biden. Putting 10,000 troops at the border will not do much to stop fentanyl coming into the US. Almost all of it comes in via legal ports of entry. Sheinbaum knows it, people in Trump’s administration know it, Trump doesn’t know or care. This is just the kind of optics-only bullshit that Trump and his supporters care about. After a few months she’ll just quietly shift them elsewhere and nobody will notice or care. She’s playing the game.

You’re right. But the problem is there a lot of low information voters that have almost no engagement with the details and history of this and will only absorb the headline.

enframed wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 10:41 am

rsmurphy wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 9:29 am All I have heard and read from Democrats over the years about enacting substantive change is that it needs to be done incrementally so we don't shake the foundation, turn moderates off, and other weak reasoning

Bernie Sanders could have beat Trump in 2020, but the party (read: all industries) didn't want him as president....IMO.

Democrats don't want any Bernie or Bernie-type leaders because ultimately both parties serve the same corporations. To wit: There are a lot of good billionaires out there that have been with Democrats, who share our values, and we will take their money. But we’re not taking money from those bad billionaires - Ken Martin DNC Chairman; add to that Pelosi shanking AOC on the Oversight Committee gig proves to me that when all is said and done the DNC wants to maintain the status quo.

Aaand another thing - I know we've been over this before but anyone blaming identity politics for our current situation is speaking from a platform of privilege.

We discussed this at the time but the purpose of the Dems is to stop any candidate like Sanders. They would rather lose that allow a genuinely progressive person lead the party.

In 2020 they performed excellently within that framework.