Re: Analog remedy to sluggish Alesis SR-16 Internal Sequencer
Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2023 7:04 pm
by brephophagist
Reaper could also send MIDI clock to the SR-16 to stabilize its timing.
Re: Analog remedy to sluggish Alesis SR-16 Internal Sequencer
Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2023 7:11 pm
by numberthirty
brephophagist wrote: Mon Apr 03, 2023 7:04 pm
Reaper could also send MIDI clock to the SR-16 to stabilize its timing.
While that's apparently a whole other can of worms?
Agreed.
Re: Analog remedy to sluggish Alesis SR-16 Internal Sequencer
Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2023 10:32 pm
by indiegrab_360
ErikG wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 1:56 pm
Your sequencer/DAW (Master) should have an option somewhere to send a MIDI clock to an external MIDI device (Slave). Somewhere in the menu there's a box you can check that says 'Send SPP' (Song Position Pointer) or 'Clock Out' or something like that. This sends continuous tempo info to the Slave. Hit the MIDI Setup button on the SR16 and page up to Clock In. It should be ON. A MIDI cable from your sequencer/DAW's selected MIDI OUT port goes to the SR16 MIDI IN port. Hit PLAY on the sequencer/ DAW. The SR16 should play with none of that 8-10 bar tempo lag you mentioned, which to me does not sound like human drummer emulation.
If you're already doing all this and it's still lagging then I don't know. Keep us posted.
Pretty sure this is exactly what I need to do. Seems pretty ridiculous though. The de-facto drum machine doesn't even keep time correctly.
I've gotta believe this guy is using a similar concept to correct the sluggishness here:
Although admittedly I recorded one piece of music just the other day and didn't correct the MIDI clock and the lag wasn't a complete deal breaker. Maybe depending on the BPM and the patterns you use it's less noticeable. I dunno.
Re: Analog remedy to sluggish Alesis SR-16 Internal Sequencer
ErikG wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 1:56 pm
Your sequencer/DAW (Master) should have an option somewhere to send a MIDI clock to an external MIDI device (Slave). Somewhere in the menu there's a box you can check that says 'Send SPP' (Song Position Pointer) or 'Clock Out' or something like that. This sends continuous tempo info to the Slave. Hit the MIDI Setup button on the SR16 and page up to Clock In. It should be ON. A MIDI cable from your sequencer/DAW's selected MIDI OUT port goes to the SR16 MIDI IN port. Hit PLAY on the sequencer/ DAW. The SR16 should play with none of that 8-10 bar tempo lag you mentioned, which to me does not sound like human drummer emulation.
If you're already doing all this and it's still lagging then I don't know. Keep us posted.
Pretty sure this is exactly what I need to do. Seems pretty ridiculous though. The de-facto drum machine doesn't even keep time correctly.
I've gotta believe this guy is using a similar concept to correct the sluggishness here:
Although admittedly I recorded one piece of music just the other day and didn't correct the MIDI clock and the lag wasn't a complete deal breaker. Maybe depending on the BPM and the patterns you use it's less noticeable. I dunno.
1) That guy isn't syncing anything. He's live playing a synth along to the drum machine. What are we missing?
2) If you are using a DAW and the SR16 has MIDI I don't understand the reluctance to just sync it to your DAW's MIDI clock.
3) If you are just commenting on the SR16's ability to keep time and are unsatisfied it, try dialing back the swing. Or quantize your patterns if you tapped them in.
Re: Analog remedy to sluggish Alesis SR-16 Internal Sequencer
Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2023 1:11 pm
by Kniferide
I gave up on hardware drum machines syncing to a daw a long time ago, not cause the sync was bad, but the sequencing always sucks. I just make samples of all my machines and use Sitala or some other sampler vst and I've never looked back.
Re: Analog remedy to sluggish Alesis SR-16 Internal Sequencer
Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2023 2:03 pm
by jimmy spako
Use some sort of free DAW with beat/BPM detection: record your drum machine jams without reference to a click, then analyse and snap to grid, if your goal is to layer everything else on top later. Much more straightforward than syncing while recording with machines liable to drift these days, I would think.
Re: Analog remedy to sluggish Alesis SR-16 Internal Sequencer
Posted: Mon Jun 12, 2023 5:23 pm
by indiegrab_360
scrotescape 4 real wrote: Mon Apr 03, 2023 6:06 am
Does this unit have the ability to chase/slave via the tape in/out? I think it does:
You would print the tape out signal to a track in the daw and set the drum machine to slave to that…Probably looser than midi and not midi —might be an option. You’d likely need a special cord
This may be the way to do it... I just tried via MIDI but in Audacity the click track is non-Midi... so I can't sync to that. I'm really trying to just use DarkAudacity for this because that's how I record music already and it works so easily. Workflow is everything. No need to download an entire new DAW just for this.
If I can figure this out I can create music so much more easily. Because I can just add in drum machine stuff after I've recorded to the click, instead of going through a ridiculous amount of clip trimming and analyzing and sequencing and layering which takes hours of clicking and dragging.
Re: Analog remedy to sluggish Alesis SR-16 Internal Sequencer
Posted: Mon Jun 12, 2023 6:56 pm
by benadrian
This is nuts. Is the sluggishness a real feature, or is it a clock issue. I used an SR-16 for years, but always standalone or recording to tape/adat. I've been though the manual a bunch. I never noticed any intentional timing to humanize, say, a lag at the end of a fill.
I'm not saying that it's not there, though, just that I've never noticed it nor heard about it in documentation or anywhere else.
I have some colleagues who may have worked on the development of the SR-16. I know they worked on the HR-16, MMT8, original ADAT, the monitor one speakers, some midiverb stuff, and maybe the "Wegde". It's actually kind of funny how much of my old home studio was developed by future co-workers. I'll poke around a bit.
Cheers!
Re: Analog remedy to sluggish Alesis SR-16 Internal Sequencer
scrotescape 4 real wrote: Mon Apr 03, 2023 6:06 am
Does this unit have the ability to chase/slave via the tape in/out? I think it does:
You would print the tape out signal to a track in the daw and set the drum machine to slave to that…Probably looser than midi and not midi —might be an option. You’d likely need a special cord
This may be the way to do it... I just tried via MIDI but in Audacity the click track is non-Midi... so I can't sync to that. I'm really trying to just use DarkAudacity for this because that's how I record music already and it works so easily. Workflow is everything. No need to download an entire new DAW just for this.
If I can figure this out I can create music so much more easily. Because I can just add in drum machine stuff after I've recorded to the click,instead of going through a ridiculous amount of clip trimming and analyzing and sequencing and layering which takes hours of clicking and dragging.
What is in "Red..." is telling me that what is in "Green..." might be bunk.
Straight talk...
In just the time that you have burned on "Pee Wee Herman Making Breakfast..." fixes on this thread?
You could already have a handle on Reaper, and be doing exactly what you seem to be saying that you want to do.
Re: Analog remedy to sluggish Alesis SR-16 Internal Sequencer
scrotescape 4 real wrote: Mon Apr 03, 2023 6:06 am
Does this unit have the ability to chase/slave via the tape in/out? I think it does:
You would print the tape out signal to a track in the daw and set the drum machine to slave to that…Probably looser than midi and not midi —might be an option. You’d likely need a special cord
This may be the way to do it... I just tried via MIDI but in Audacity the click track is non-Midi... so I can't sync to that. I'm really trying to just use DarkAudacity for this because that's how I record music already and it works so easily. Workflow is everything. No need to download an entire new DAW just for this.
If I can figure this out I can create music so much more easily. Because I can just add in drum machine stuff after I've recorded to the click,instead of going through a ridiculous amount of clip trimming and analyzing and sequencing and layering which takes hours of clicking and dragging.
What is in "Red..." is telling me that what is in "Green..." might be bunk.
Straight talk...
In just the time that you have burned on "Pee Wee Herman Making Breakfast..." fixes on this thread?
You could already have a handle on Reaper, and be doing exactly what you seem to be saying that you want to do.
Here's the exact explanation of what's going on. I'm not learning Reaper unless someone pays me to. $1000 and I'll learn it and put up a video demo of how to do it on Cubase.