i'd live in a lighthouse. then again, i have the kind of friends who would really dig hanging out in a lighthouse.

aew wrote:There is something akin to chronic art student syndrome going round. (especially when it comes to the subject of god, which is a spec-fuckin-tacularly difficult topic, dismissed quickly as being bullshit by someone trying to sound smart)
It does remind alot of those gawd awful fanzines that you get outside gigs.

Succinctly put, Ali.

aew wrote:There is something akin to chronic art student syndrome going round. (especially when it comes to the subject of god, which is a spec-fuckin-tacularly difficult topic, dismissed quickly as being bullshit by someone trying to sound smart)
It does remind alot of those gawd awful fanzines that you get outside gigs.

I think the discussions about religion here completely disprove your assertion. Religious people tend to think they are the only people who have given the matter due consideration, a prejudice I consider insulting in the extreme. The conversations on this messageboard show that there are plenty of people who have taken the topic of religion seriously enough to study it, and after doing so have come to the conclusion that it is a man-made construction with no other basis. I am one of them.

I enjoyed reading the Bible, and I recommend it to everyone, as it is sure to create more atheists, and we could use more hands on deck in the culture war the Christians (who are largely ignorant of this text) are waging on us.

steve wrote:Religious people tend to think they are the only people who have given the matter due consideration, a prejudice I consider insulting in the extreme.

This is something that annoys me profoundly. I remember one occasion when this guy approached me in Manchester city centre. He claimed to be doing research for his thesis and it would be helpful to him if I answered some questions for him. Sucked in by his lie (incidentally, I seem to remember Jesus & co. not being too keen on them things), I obliged. After a couple of warm-up vaguely academic sounding questions, he asked me "Have you ever thought about the meaning of life?" and "Have you ever thought about God?". I was dicked off enough by the fact that this guy had gotten me in to some twatty conversation by lying to me in order to peddle his propaganda to me. But what really, truly, enraged me was the tacit implication that as an aethist I'd never considered these questions.

"Have you ever thought about the meaning of life?"
"Hmmmm, now I come to think of it, no. I have spent 24 years in an existential coma, a biological automaton who only entertains the thought of girls' boobies and my own gratification."

What the fuck is this attitude? It is ludicrous and makes me fucking sick.

I also have read the bible, studied some theology at University, etc - my rejection of Christiantity (or any religion) is not as reactionary as you'd like to think.

I don't like this term, this "putting on airs." It makes it too easy to dismiss a person's ideas by decrying them "arrogant" or "bougeouise." It's a convenient tool, used commonly by the right, to shift the debate from the merits of the idea itself, to the percieved attitude of the person who has the idea.

It's bullying. It's wrong.

To claim that there is "chronic-art-student syndrome" going on here is to casually (and incorrectly) lump those of us who are knowledgeable and articulate about a particular subject in with those of us who are trying mightily (and with greater of lesser degrees of success) to measure up to the intelligence and great writing here.

Perhaps that's difference between Matthew and me. I'm not offended by someone attempting to measure up to the people that they admire. I'm not offended by someone who uses "big words" and makes an effort to grasp complex moral, intellectual, ethical questions.

There lots of people here who's intelligence I admire. I'm thankful for them.

Tim, Steve, LAD, Linus, Kerble, Angus, Scott, BER, Brad Weissenberger, barun, bumble, si-maro, Johnny Shape, Itchy . . . you are great writers! Salut!

Steve: No i dont agree with that at all, and i'm a little shocked of your prejudiced view of religious people. You guys seem to love having matthew around because he personifies the religious straw man you kick the shit out of.

For the record I dont agree with Matthew with a lot of what he says.

I've never said that religious people are the only people who've looked into the subject of god. You made that for me and then knocked it down.

Personally, I'm a theist agnostic, and i find it backwards to push either conclusion about god. There isn't really enough to prove anything conclusively, and what i'm referring to are people here who refer to religion as nothing but social control. To me that's a mid-schoolers way of sounding smart.

From what i've seen with patients, the hope of something beyond their treatment and short life expectancy, faith does really help people. That is why i think holistic medicine is something that is really in need of research.

I'll hunt down the research that shows that religion has a significant effect on life expectancy. This isn't great, but for now.... You wouldn't know that from reading non-scientific, opinion based philosophy suspended in nothing, based on next to nothing.

(on a side note: I'm reading the bible as great piece of literature, and for the first time as an adult I'm starting to go over some the muslim stories I heard as a kid, and I beginning to realize, they're great stories, in particular the story of moses and his brother, against the pharaoh and Haman who is a bit of media mogul back then... the muslim version of haman is different by the way).

kerble wrote:

Do many EA Forum posters put on an air of lofty intellect?

aew wrote:I thought it was a good metaphor (though personally i would have kept it to about 4 lines).

thanks for answering that one, Ali.




Faiz

Your welcome, I'll even let you pick my pubes out of your teeth if it makes me more lofty .
(Edit: it was meant to be light-hearted/ childish, I genuinely wasn't trying to be offensive.)

Sorry i missed your post mate, I think it's much more simple and fundamental problem.

FMajcinek wrote: I'm not offended by someone who uses "big words" and makes an effort to grasp complex moral, intellectual, ethical questions.

You've hit that nail on the head there. I am offended you see.
The most impressive seen i've seen was a cardiologist explaining angioplasty,to a teenage boy and a mother, about how the procedure that was about to be performed on a the father/husband.
After seeing how somebody uses the most basic straight-forward non-patronizing language, to explain something of direct use, I just can't help but squirm when i see some smug smarmy responses about Marxism, or Jungian psychology or any other student fodder.

I dont think the people here are stupid at all, I dare say the average IQ here is higher than that of the average net IQ, it's just there's much more of an emphasis on writing elegant and eloquent stuff rather than terse purposeful stuff.

I'm not here to stop it, I will however step in if someone implies that i'm a backwater bigot, and by proxy an inferior person. I will address the argument directly and on it's merits, but this threat was about a lofty air of intellect, and I think people do.

si-maro wrote:
"Hmmmm, now I come to think of it, no. I have spent 24 years in an existential coma, a biological automaton who only entertains the thought of girls' boobies and my own gratification."

Well, I didn't want to be the one to say it but now you put it so bluntly...

Also, am I the only one who thought Matthew's

"Great, now I am a Shellac song"

comment was funny?

Not sure about all this God stuff though.

aew wrote: I'm not here to stop it, I will however step in if someone implies that i'm a backwater bigot, and by proxy an inferior person.

Who are you talking about? Marsupialised ranting about Arabs? You should read his posts and the threads he started here. He is an asshole and he knows it.

I honestly do not think anybody here thinks of you as a backwater bigot, let alone an inferior person. Chill out a bit, Ali.