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brings to mind a nice redman ditty, by the title "iz he 4 real??"[/quote]

"You, you sayin' somethin'?"
"WHATEVER MAN..."
(Muddy Waters, great album.)


The decendants of Jacob were chosen to to be a witness for God to ALL people.
That is a humble mission. Not a Master Race fantasy.
Their inheritance is that land and His protection and final victory.
(HIS final victory, not there's.)
In the course of that mission they will go thru many trials. They have done and will continue to do so.
(Hitler is dead and left not much good worth remembering. The Jews abide and prosper.)

Israel is a thorn in the side of Islam. If Muslums don't wipe out Israel, it means their religion is a fraud.
(They won't, and it is.)
It's Jacob vs. Esau. This is nothing new.



Let's just say this.
If the Palestinians and surrounding Arab states would accept their Israeli neighbors and co-operate with them, THEY WOULD BE FAR BETTER OFF THAN THEY ARE NOW.
(60 years of fighting, and what good have they gotten from it? NONE!)

That won't happen though.

krakabash wrote:Israel is a thorn in the side of Islam.

Israel is a thorn in everyone's side, big fella.

Christ, and I thought Truesoul was nutty...

Israel is a blessing to the World.

Don't get it twisted.

Thurs. March 6 - Time news

"A Palestinian armed with a semi-automatic rifle opened fire on a dining room full of Jewish religious students...killing eight, and wounding eight others.
In Gaza, news of the attack was greeted with celebratory gunfire, cars honking their horns, and people passing out candy in the streets...
...peace prospects look even dimmer."

Hip Hop, and it don't stop...

floog wrote:

krakabash wrote:Israel is a thorn in the side of Islam.

Israel is a thorn in everyone's side, big fella.

Christ, and I thought Truesoul was nutty...

Might I enlighten you to the fact that Israel defending their land bravely against invasion from Egypt, Syria, Iraq and Jordan and kicked all of their fucking ass in the 6 Day War. One lone Jewish state against Arabian behemoths.

The fact that Israel against all criticisms is an independent, democratic state with freedom of religion extended to all faiths.

What I find disturbing is the hypocrisy that it is okay in the Middle Eastern world to have Islam established states but oppose a Jewish one. The radical fringe consisting of Hamas will never accept coexistence with jews. Not Palestinians but radical HAMAS, a difference.

People like Rick Reuben here would love for Hamas or any of the other radical Islamic groups to take over all of Israel.

It is the bias on these boards that is sickening.

There is nothing wrong with Islam or Palestine.

There is something wrong with Hamas, Hezbollah, Taliban and Al-Qaeda. They are all cut from the same cloth. They are roaches that need to be exterminated.

Maybe you need a history lesson but the land of "Palestine" was never the land of "Palestian Muslims". The land has been the home of cultures and civilizations long before the formation of Islam. Just like the North American Indians came over from a land bridge and were not indigenous to North America. So that argument doesn't hold water.

Israelites came to the land of "Palestine" around roughly 1020 BCE. Before being driven out later.

Also Judaism PREDATES ISLAM.

Then you have your subsequent Roman, Ottoman, Egypt controlled "Palestine" after the Israelities were driven out.

To say that it was always the home of the "Palestinians" is grossly innaccurate.


The fact that when there was another exodus of Jews after British role ended in the early 20th Century, Muslims didn't like. The fact that they wanted to establish a country because they believe it is a Holy Land according to their Bible, much like the Palestinians want to dispute it on religious grounds. A war was started as a result because Israel wanted to consolidate its power and establish borders.



But getting off track here.

The fact that you don't comdemn the actions of groups like Hamas or Hezzebollah shows your bias. You just squirm from these issues which shows you have no credibility.

What is laughable though is that you live in some fantasy world where you think groups like Hamas or The Taliban or any country represented by an "Islamic Republic" are somehow tolerant and demoratic.

The fact that you don't acknowledge the hypocritical nature of radical Islam and somehow think it should be accepted without taking them to task.

Carnival of Souls wrote:To say that it was always the home of the Palestinians is grossly innaccurate.

I didn't say it always was- I said it was their home in 1948, and then the Zionists stole it using extortion, bribery, and force. Real holy of you.

If the Jews are such ass-kicking warriors, why weren't they all marching back to Palestine in the 1700's or the 1800's or the early 1900's and driving the Arabs off their Holy Lands? What took them so long to start kicking ass down there? How could they live with themselves in Europe or the US, being so far from their 'homeland'?

In 1895, the total population of Palestine was 500,000 of whom 47,000 were Jews who owned 0.5% of the land.

Normally, the people who are last to own a piece of land hold the title ( and especially true in this case, since you can't prove that that Palestinians ever stole the land from you ). Real shady of you thieves to turn the clock back 2000 years and claim it was yours all along, based on some Old Testament shit that counts as law nowhere else on the planet.

Zionists: "God gave us this land."

The rest of the world: "Produce God so he may tell us Himself."

Zionists: "Take our word for it."

carnival of souls wrote:What is laughable though is that you live in some fantasy world where you think groups like Hamas or The Taliban or any country represented by an "Islamic Republic" are somehow tolerant and demoratic.

I've never said any such thing, dopey. I've said they have a right to defend themselves, and I've said that it's none of my business what type of republic they choose.

Utterly ridiculous.

And you don't think that groups like Hamas and the radical fringes of Palestine aren't going to argue that the land of Israel/Palestine isn't their own by divine right of Islam, making it a religious issue?

You would like to live in a vacccum. This whole idea of land is fought over the idea of religion, not just land.

clocker bob wrote:

Carnival of Souls wrote:To say that it was always the home of the Palestinians is grossly innaccurate.

I didn't say it always was- I said it was their home in 1948, and then the Zionists stole it using extortion, bribery, and force. Real holy of you.

If the Jews are such ass-kicking warriors, why weren't they all marching back to Palestine in the 1700's or the 1800's or the early 1900's and driving the Arabs off their Holy Lands? What took them so long to start kicking ass down there? How could they live with themselves in Europe or the US, being so far from their 'homeland'?

In 1895, the total population of Palestine was 500,000 of whom 47,000 were Jews who owned 0.5% of the land.

Normally, the people who are last to own a piece of land hold the title ( and especially true in this case, since you can't prove that that Palestinians ever stole the land from you ). Real shady of you thieves to turn the clock back 2000 years and claim it was yours all along, based on some Old Testament shit that counts as law nowhere else on the planet.

Zionists: "God gave us this land."

The rest of the world: "Produce God so he may tell us Himself."

Zionists: "Take our word for it."

carnival of souls wrote:What is laughable though is that you live in some fantasy world where you think groups like Hamas or The Taliban or any country represented by an "Islamic Republic" are somehow tolerant and demoratic.

I've never said any such thing, dopey. I've said they have a right to defend themselves, and I've said that it's none of my business what type of republic they choose.

The LAST people to own it? Wrong. It was still in a state of fluctuation.

And Isarelities also don't have a right ot defend themselves by that rationale?

You still have a bias.

Rick Reuben wrote:

Ty Webb wrote: As for LIHOP, you're saying the election was just another machination and the results could've been changed by Israel as they saw fit?

More like 'Hamas in power creates an excuse not to negotiate'.

Richard Sale in UPI, after the 2006 election:

Israel and Hamas may currently be locked in deadly combat, but, according to several current and former U.S. intelligence officials, beginning in the late 1970s, Tel Aviv gave direct and indirect financial aid to Hamas over a period of years. Israel 'aided Hamas directly – the Israelis wanted to use it as a counterbalance to the PLO (Palestinian Liberation Organization),' said Tony Cordesman, Middle East analyst for the Center for Strategic [and International] Studies. Israel's support for Hamas 'was a direct attempt to divide and dilute support for a strong, secular PLO by using a competing religious alternative,' said a former senior CIA official.

Well, Israel learned the myopic policy of propping up one strongman over another for political expedience from the authority on the subject - the US.

But there has been plenty of buzz lately in foreign policy journalism that negotiations with Hamas are inevitable and that feelers are even being put out by this administration. (That Vanity Fair article may even mention something about that.)

I'm not sure that I agree that the Bushies don't want a peaceful, two-state resolution to the crisis. They just don't want an equitable one. They still think that they can shape democracy in their own image (ha!). Their greed and historical deafness make them completely inept at this whole process.