jason from volo wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:51 pm I'm upset, but I expected the ruling.

It's Wisconsin and it's Wisconsin's laws.

And I don't think the prosecution did a very good job.

If that's the sumtotal of your reaction, it's the hearing you deserve, to be fair. Well done.

The precedent being set here, that at 17 you can go patrol Wisconsin with a machine gun shooting anyone who looks at you funny, is truly absurd.

jason from volo wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:35 pm

zorg wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:13 pm The precedent being set here, that at 17 you can go patrol Wisconsin with a machine gun shooting anyone who looks at you funny, is truly absurd.

Absolutely 100% agree.

I’d be interested in hearing from some of the folks from Wisconsin on here.

I will be thinking twice next time I have an inclination to visit their otherwise fine state.

I moved away years ago, because once you get outside Dane or Milwaukee counties, it's basically Alabama with far fewer PoC and everyone in XXXL green & yellow jerseys instead of red & white. Aggrieved white resentment is the official fucking state pastime for anyone that lives outside of Madison or Milwaukee. And even Milwaukee is a hyper-segregated shit-mess nobody seems ready to come to terms with.

zorg wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:13 pm The precedent being set here, that at 17 you can go patrol Wisconsin with a machine gun shooting anyone who looks at you funny, is truly absurd.

I'm astonished by the behaviour of the judge (at least as reported here in the UK). Did he really:

• Prevent anyone using the word 'victim' for the - erm - victims?
• Say that you only had to consider the immediate situation - i.e. did the accused feel threatened at that moment, not (as you say) had the accused cross into another state with an assault rifle (presumably illegally?) into a heated situation?
• Have the Trump theme ('God Bless the U.S.A.') as his ringtone?

It just seems like a very black comedy, not justice.

The precedent being set is that armed right-wing vigilantes can turn up to any protest and start killing protesters with impunity. The cops won't stop them, the courts won't stop them, and the Republicans will treat them like heroes. I imagine we'll be seeing plenty more of this, if the US still has any will to protest left. But it's hard to be too upset when this all seemed like such a foregone conclusion.

Just a few short months after the end of the Donald Tump dumpster fire of criminality and treason, Republicans are already poised to take back control of the US government, enact permanent minority rule through force, shut down any attempt at climate change mitigation, and bring about the end of human civilisation. So in the grand scheme of things this is only about as upsetting as reading the news on any other given day. The world is dying and fascists are taking over everywhere you look. . Honestly at this point in history would anyone even be particularly surprised if WW3 kicked off?

You know my whole life I have felt like the future is bleak. Sense of doom hanging over everything. I'm sure I'm not alone. Wouldn't it be nice to believe that the future might be better? To think that I might have grandchildren one day, or that the trees I plant in my garden won't be underwater in fifty years. A sense of being a part of a society that was moving forward in a positive direction rather than a society that is slowly dying from multiple metastasizing cancers, wouldn't that be nice. To have hope that was realistic rather than just wishful thinking. But from this vantage point I don't see the arc of history bending towards justice, it seems to bend towards corruption just like Plato said.

The arc of justice bends to the actionable will of the people. Passive is as passive does.

jason from volo wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 4:02 pm There are smarter and more effective ways to go about this.

Oh right. I take it all back then. Didn't realise you had it under control. Look forward to waking up in the morning and seeing those wheels in motion

A_Man_Who_Tries wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 4:11 pm

jason from volo wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 4:02 pm There are smarter and more effective ways to go about this.

Oh right. I take it all back then. Didn't realise you had it under control. Look forward to waking up in the morning and seeing those wheels in motion

Taking to the streets to burn down your own neighborhood and smash windows has a stellar fucking track record too.

If the populace leans toward consistently putting cunts in office, a week of petty vandalism and violence will only solidify the prejudices of those who put the cunts in office in the first place and the heavy-handed response of the cunts themselves.

Temper tantrums do nothing. Temper tantrums do not amount to or result in "redress of grievances".

Geiginni wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 4:46 pm Temper tantrums do nothing. Temper tantrums do not amount to or result in "redress of grievances".

I can't think of one time that advances in civil rights have been gained without civil unrest and/or protest.

jason from volo wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:28 pm Protesting is not *my* best option, that’s all I am saying.

The right to protest is slowly eroding away. We all do what we have to do.