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I find the ice cream “incident” almost more offensive than the typically murderous reaction from the Muslim community to the pictures.

I agree with Cranius that some of the pictures are a little racist, but… the main offensive picture was one of all the deities illustrated and “God” saying something to the effect, “We all have to put up with this Mohammed…” and is a clearly making a point about self-censorship. That the French paper sacked its editor is disgusting.

‘If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear’

George Orwell.

Gramsci wrote:I find the ice cream “incident” is almost more offensive than the typically murderous reaction from the Muslim community to the pictures.

It's certainly nothing to get your turban in a twist about.

(that's a joke)

Cranius wrote:

Gramsci wrote:I find the ice cream “incident” is almost more offensive than the typically murderous reaction from the Muslim community to the pictures.

It's certainly nothing to get your turban in a twist about.

(that's a joke)

As long as someone doesn't walk into a BK and blow themselves up.

[winky bang face]

Anyway...joking aside, here is a page that contains all of the cartoons in question. Judge for yourselves:

Jyllands Posten's Mohammed Cartoons

I think for the most part they seem ill-considered and moronic. As Kerble pointed out, Mohammed just isn't depicted in Islam; the only depictions of him are western. I also presume there are no depictions of the prophet Jesus in Islam either, so the whole exercise seems quite perverse.

Cranius wrote:Anyway...joking aside, here is a page that contains all of the cartoons in question. Judge for yourselves:

Jyllands Posten's Mohammed Cartoons

I think for the most part they seem ill considered and moronic. As Kerble pointed out, Mohammed just isn't depicted in Islam; the only depictions of him are western. I also presume there are no depictions of the prophet Jesus in Islam either, so the whole exercise seems quite perverse.

But that isn't really the point, the point is freedom of the press and expression. And in my book being offensive or insensitive aren't and should never be illegal.

The cartoons may be childish, but Muslims are just going to have to have a grown up attitude to this, they can't go threatening people everytime they feel offended, look what happened to Rushdie!

Gramsci wrote:

Cranius wrote:Anyway...joking aside, here is a page that contains all of the cartoons in question. Judge for yourselves:

Jyllands Posten's Mohammed Cartoons

I think for the most part they seem ill considered and moronic. As Kerble pointed out, Mohammed just isn't depicted in Islam; the only depictions of him are western. I also presume there are no depictions of the prophet Jesus in Islam either, so the whole exercise seems quite perverse.

But that isn't really the point, the point is freedom of the press and expression. And in my book being offensive or insensitive aren't and should never be illegal.

The cartoons may be childish, but Muslims are just going to have to have a grown up attitude to this, they can't go threatening people everytime they feel offended, look what happened to Rushdie!

Of course, you're absolutely right and it's important for Europe to reinforce it's secular ideals over this issue, but I can't help feeling there is certain amount of provocation of Muslims going on here.

I imagine that the editors of the danish newspaper are pretty embarrassed by fall-out from all of this. Danish ambassadors are being recalled from arab countries and there looks to be a boycott of Danish foodstuffs and commodities in the Middle-East (although, I expect they already boycott Danish bacon). Simultaneously, Danish soldiers in Iraq are now in considerable danger.

Of course, there is a certain hipocrisy in the muslim reaction, as I'm certain that newspapers in arab countries regularly carry some horrible caricatures of Jews.

People of faith need to learn to be a little more robust.

Cranius wrote:...
People of faith need to learn to be a little more robust.

Agreed, but these Islamic crazy guys in Gaza obviously think the creator of the universe needs a little help defending his honour... it doesn't really say much for this god of theirs.

Full Set

They're a load of crap though.

Rotten Tanx wrote:Fuck em.

If by "em", Tanx, you refer to the people who wish to censor this publications, than yeah: Fuck em.

Islam is not a race. It´s a belief system. An attack on a belief system is not an attack on people. The distinction is fundamental to the Western idea of pluriformity. The people who wish to censor this stuff have (once again, I´d like to say) proven that they have no time for pluriformity and dissenting opinions. They have no respect for the very system that allows them to exist peacefully in secular societies. It is a dangerous lot.

Fuck ´em.

Oh, and those cartoons are unfunny crap.

This one is really the only one they needed to print to make the point.



However, this isn't about the quality of the cartoons, it's about one of our most important freedoms, free speech, which isn't up for negotiation in any form. So Islam is just going to have to get used to being treated the shame as every other idea.