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Lonesome Bulldog wrote:Fuck 6-4-3's opinion. Just because some people hate the sound of simulated warfare means they're no fun at parties? Fuck you.

if one were to try and simulate the sound of warfare, wouldn't one want to include stuff like, I dunno, explosions, rockets, missles, bullets,stuff like that?

why do you equate the sound of a jet flying fast and low with the sound of warfare?




i'm pretty sure the reason some cities (like Chicago) have airshows is because people representing those cities go to great lengths to make it happen. the reason they do it is not as a commercial for the military, or war, but rather because it generates revenue, it brings in tourism, and helps a city to have a presence in the nation or even world.

it's kind of a win-win situation, except for those folks who complain about the noise or about war or death or whatever their mind focuses on when they hear/see a fighter jet. and for whatever reason, it seems that complaining doesn't generate revenue for a city and its businesses. go figure.

Ty Webb wrote:So what are air shows in peace time? I mean, these things happen all the time, right?

It just seems like such a petty thing, in relation to war propaganda, to be complaining about, when far more egregious, direct, and sadly effective bits of propaganda are on our airwaves and in our newspapers every day.

"Sorry, kids. No jets for you. Here's a daisy and some Nerf Legos."

Little kids don't read newspapers, so they don't get those messages.

This one they do get.

scott wrote:

Lonesome Bulldog wrote:Fuck 6-4-3's opinion. Just because some people hate the sound of simulated warfare means they're no fun at parties? Fuck you.

if one were to try and simulate the sound of warfare, wouldn't one want to include stuff like, I dunno, explosions, rockets, missles, bullets,stuff like that?

why do you equate the sound of a jet flying fast and low with the sound of warfare?

Those particular jets exist only for warfare, that's why we associate them with warfare. A-doy.

scott wrote:i'm pretty sure the reason some cities (like Chicago) have airshows is because people representing those cities go to great lengths to make it happen. the reason they do it is not as a commercial for the military, or war, but rather because it generates revenue, it brings in tourism, and helps a city to have a presence in the nation or even world.

it's kind of a win-win situation, except for those folks who complain about the noise or about war or death or whatever their mind focuses on when they hear/see a fighter jet. and for whatever reason, it seems that complaining doesn't generate revenue for a city and its businesses. go figure.

Believe it or not, Chicago's a pretty robust city economically, even without the Air show, and already has a fairly large presence in the world.

Also, some of that precious revenue for the city is offset by the taxes used on the planes in the first place.

yeah, and as a kid I saw all kinda stuff with messages in it, I think. I used to have a plastic M-16 that I saved up money for and bought, so me and other neighborhood kids could "play guns".

I never joined the military, and never supported this "war" on terror.

I never saw a "computer programming show" as a kid where doudes did a bunch of loud, cool, flashy programming.

so it looks like your sense of causality/propaganda imprint is a little off. maybe a kid could see an airshow and not grow up to support war or fly a bomber or whatever it is you presume these children will do.

and if you think an airshow is more of a brainwashing mechanism than videogames (which I love) or teevee/movies (which I like) then I dunno what to tell you. maybe go get a cabin in the woods at the bottom of the ocean inside a volcano on the moon or something?

scott wrote:so it looks like your sense of causality/propaganda imprint is a little off. maybe a kid could see an airshow and not grow up to support war or fly a bomber or whatever it is you presume these children will do.

Sure, some won't, but some will.

Why can't I be against this effort to engage children with real life violence (which differs from the video games you've mentioned)?

More important, why are you for it?

jurgis rudkus wrote:
Those particular jets exist only for warfare, that's why we associate them with warfare. A-doy.

I'm pretty sure they don't send the Blue Angels into combat. Correct me if I'm wrong though.

I'd say the combination of screaming fighters and exploding fireworks is pretty goddamn similar to the sounds of warfare, scott.

I'm not concerned with any brainwashing or propaganda; I just think airshows are stupid and should be confined to AIRFIELDS. That they're cranking over your city seems way too obtrusive. And to call someone a bore for not enjoying it (do YOU have airshows at your party?) is pretty weak.

Plus I feel like getting into an argument. Everybody can suck it!

Andrew Weatherhead wrote:

jurgis rudkus wrote:
Those particular jets exist only for warfare, that's why we associate them with warfare. A-doy.

I'm pretty sure they don't send the Blue Angels into combat. Correct me if I'm wrong though.

Perhaps not those specific B.A. ones painted blue, but those plane models were not developed by the military/industry for light entertainment, I'm certain.

You disagree? They put a couple billion into those designs to have something sexy for summer weekends?

jurgis rudkus wrote:Why can't I be against this effort to engage children with real life violence (which differs from the video games you've mentioned)?

More important, why are you for it?

it is only an effort to engage children with violence inside your head. that's not what it is out here in "real life". there is no violence in an airshow, except if there's a crash. and as many folks know, and many would tell you, hoping to see a crash is the main thing that some people find engaging about an airshow.

I already told you why I'm for the airshow. go back and read my first post on this thread, in case you didn't pay attention the first time or any subsequent times when it was quoted.

Keep our kids away from Jeeps! (War machines originally.)
Keep our kids away from military surplus clothing!
Keep our kids away from parachutes! (Wartime invention.)
Keep our kids away from combat boots!


And if this was deliberate war time propaganda aimed at children, wouldn't they paint the jets something a little more military instead of brilliant blue and yellow?

I hate this war and everything about it, but saying an air show is an attempt to brainwash children into admiring war is borderline hysteria.