Reckoning
Fables of the Reconstruction
Document - tied with - Chronic Town
Murmur - tied with - Green
Lifes Rich Pageant
Dead Letter Office


Lifes has the most "filler" of the proper LPs. The non-single tracks on Green are all great. Reckoning's recording still gets me - Mills/Berry's backing vocals never sounded better. DLO has some nice cuts, but I'd much rather spin Eponymous, which has "Romance" and the alt. vocal take of "Gardening at Night."

Pretty much a toss-up between the first two. Reckoning may be a little more direct and clear but I really dig Murmur's murk. I love all these albums up to and including Document. Green is where I lose interest. R.E.M. was so much more fun when you couldn't decipher Stipe's words. I still don't know what the hell he's talking about in most of these songs. It's fascinating. Sometimes it seems like the actual words don't matter, he's just using combinations of vowels and consonants that sound good together. Compare the lyrics on this version of Radio Free Europe with the studio cut:

tonyballzee wrote: Wed Aug 23, 2023 3:39 pm Pretty much a toss-up between the first two. Reckoning may be a little more direct and clear but I really dig Murmur's murk. I love all these albums up to and including Document. Green is where I lose interest. R.E.M. was so much more fun when you couldn't decipher Stipe's words. I still don't know what the hell he's talking about in most of these songs. It's fascinating. Sometimes it seems like the actual words don't matter, he's just using combinations of vowels and consonants that sound good together. Compare the lyrics on this version of Radio Free Europe with the studio cut:

I haven't given this band much thought at all for at least 30 years. But during the time I was in high-school these guys were a polestar in the constellation of music I was listening to at the time.

What you describe is entirely in line with my feelings at that time and now. I loved that Stipe was uncomfortable in his own skin. I loved that they were a rock band that was really bad at "rocking". I loved the contrapuntal feel of Mills' bass playing against similarly contrapuntal guitar overdubs by Barry. Once all those elements had been lost to maturity, I not longer had much reason to care. The oddness and awkwardness was gone, and they were writing the same banal pop songs as Natalie Merchant and umpteen other similar acts.

Geiginni wrote: Thu Aug 24, 2023 5:57 pm

tonyballzee wrote: Wed Aug 23, 2023 3:39 pm Pretty much a toss-up between the first two. Reckoning may be a little more direct and clear but I really dig Murmur's murk. I love all these albums up to and including Document. Green is where I lose interest. R.E.M. was so much more fun when you couldn't decipher Stipe's words. I still don't know what the hell he's talking about in most of these songs. It's fascinating. Sometimes it seems like the actual words don't matter, he's just using combinations of vowels and consonants that sound good together. Compare the lyrics on this version of Radio Free Europe with the studio cut:

I haven't given this band much thought at all for at least 30 years. But during the time I was in high-school these guys were a polestar in the constellation of music I was listening to at the time.

What you describe is entirely in line with my feelings at that time and now. I loved that Stipe was uncomfortable in his own skin. I loved that they were a rock band that was really bad at "rocking". I loved the contrapuntal feel of Mills' bass playing against similarly contrapuntal guitar overdubs by Barry. Once all those elements had been lost to maturity, I not longer had much reason to care. The oddness and awkwardness was gone, and they were writing the same banal pop songs as Natalie Merchant and umpteen other similar acts.

Agreed. R.E.M's "maturity" caused the group to abandon what was unique and cool about them in the first place. I still can't understand why so many people went apeshit over the incredibly bland pop of Losing My Religion and Everybody Hurts and all that. The Natalie Merchant comparison is spot on.

tonyballzee wrote: Fri Aug 25, 2023 4:52 pm

Geiginni wrote: Thu Aug 24, 2023 5:57 pm

tonyballzee wrote: Wed Aug 23, 2023 3:39 pm Pretty much a toss-up between the first two. Reckoning may be a little more direct and clear but I really dig Murmur's murk. I love all these albums up to and including Document. Green is where I lose interest. R.E.M. was so much more fun when you couldn't decipher Stipe's words. I still don't know what the hell he's talking about in most of these songs. It's fascinating. Sometimes it seems like the actual words don't matter, he's just using combinations of vowels and consonants that sound good together. Compare the lyrics on this version of Radio Free Europe with the studio cut:

I haven't given this band much thought at all for at least 30 years. But during the time I was in high-school these guys were a polestar in the constellation of music I was listening to at the time.

What you describe is entirely in line with my feelings at that time and now. I loved that Stipe was uncomfortable in his own skin. I loved that they were a rock band that was really bad at "rocking". I loved the contrapuntal feel of Mills' bass playing against similarly contrapuntal guitar overdubs by Barry. Once all those elements had been lost to maturity, I not longer had much reason to care. The oddness and awkwardness was gone, and they were writing the same banal pop songs as Natalie Merchant and umpteen other similar acts.

Agreed. R.E.M's "maturity" caused the group to abandon what was unique and cool about them in the first place. I still can't understand why so many people went apeshit over the incredibly bland pop of Losing My Religion and Everybody Hurts and all that. The Natalie Merchant comparison is spot on.

At the same time I feel no ill will toward where they went or the changes they made. I appreciate that everyone matures and changes and develops (and in the case of someone like David Byrne, it can be a really good thing). It needed to happen and they seemed to handle it well and retain control over their creations, fame and money. But, personally, they could have called it quits at the same time as The Smiths and my musical world would not have noticed any change. But I'm glad they were able to keep it going as long as they liked and were able to support and promote other artists using their fame.

I would have never guessed when I was jamming to Reckoning on the school bus in the mid 80s that I'd be obsessed with the keyboard works of Bach and his sons 30 years later. So I will not feign surprise if I was into Donizetti operas and Laplander folk songs when I'm in the memory care unit in another 30 years.

tonyballzee wrote: Fri Aug 25, 2023 4:52 pm

Geiginni wrote: Thu Aug 24, 2023 5:57 pm Once all those elements had been lost to maturity, I not longer had much reason to care. The oddness and awkwardness was gone, and they were writing the same banal pop songs as Natalie Merchant and umpteen other similar acts.

Agreed. R.E.M's "maturity" caused the group to abandon what was unique and cool about them in the first place. I still can't understand why so many people went apeshit over the incredibly bland pop of Losing My Religion and Everybody Hurts and all that. The Natalie Merchant comparison is spot on.

Answer seems obvious to me… bland pop sells a shit-ton of records.

That being said, I love all R.E.M. records up to the departure of Berry. There is still plenty of weirdness in those records, just as there were elements of pop from the beginning, too.

Yeah, Losing My Religion is incredibly distinct. It's not difficult or edgy but it's definitely unique. When it comes on the radio or at a coffee shop or whatever, it's not like I get super pumped, but it creates it's own space which is more than I can say for a lot of middle of the road music.

I remember their 90s stuff being just as good. They were just terrific songwriters.

The kept writing awesome songs in the nineties. But the records had a lot of fat.

Although I think Out of time is better than green and probably their last great record; Except for the bland opening song with the rapper, the record is great. And the recording is of my fave.

Automatic had some really great songs but half of the record was meh. Monster had a cool guitar tone but for the first time they seeemed uninspired. New adventures is a bit like Automatic, too much fat.

Up is interesting but it is evident the magic is gone.

For those who may have missed it