OK, this gets a gigantic ...

Either someone guessed Wernehm's password (izaguf) and is busy trying to make him look like a twit, or he's crossed the line from annoying and abusive into full-troll. Reviving long-dead threads for the purpose of sarcastically putting forth strawman arguments to ridicule the fans of bands he hates...

Well, there exist two appropriate responses to a troll, and I'm too busy for acronyms right now.

Linus Van Pelt wrote:Reviving long-dead threads

Long dead? I didn't post since Friday. I came back here on Tuesday (that's today), and it was the 2nd post on the list! This tells me a lot about the Electrical forum crowd. Sitting at home on the weekend, typing into your computer, secretly hoping to kiss a girl by the time you're 27.

I hear how annoying this thread is. How you'd all wish it would die. Then you all come back. Sanctimonious losers, I would have to say...

Any board that gives The Cure an 80% rating, and Zappa 50%... Well, that says a lot! "Hello small town America... My name is David Kendall, and I would like to charm you into assembling a collection of really great 'alternative' CD's based on who gobbled my knob last week. There's this exciting new band called U2. Really at the fore-front of modern music."

Yeah, man... I'm into Albini because he recorded Nirvana. The best band ever!

Get a clue. Better yet, go out and get "Ship Arriving Late To Save A Drowning Witch". With the 80's suckers on this board, you'll actually enjoy it. No, really. It's about as good as any Cure album.

I know no one here is stupid to think that when I said "reviving long-dead threads" that I was talking about this thread. In case anyone was wondering what I was talking about, it was these:

http://www.electrical.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=567 (pixies)

http://www.electrical.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=995 (cure)

http://www.electrical.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3632 (jesus & mary chain)

That's all.

Except these:
http://www.electrical.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=777 (radiohead)
http://www.electrical.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3231 (robyn hitchcock)
http://www.electrical.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=899 (ministry)

Linus Van Pelt wrote:I know no one here is stupid to think that when I said "reviving long-dead threads" that I was talking about this thread. In case anyone was wondering what I was talking about, it was these:

http://www.electrical.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=567

http://www.electrical.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=995

http://www.electrical.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3632

That's all.

Except this:
http://www.electrical.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=777

Actually, the Bauhaus one is a new one. Such a fine band!

The Kid wrote:Wait a minute, what did Zappa say about the Velvet Underground? Because if he insulted them, I am gonna KILL HIM.

I think you're thinking of Toto. Zappa had a few songs that ragged on Toto. Severely...

Zappa should have made fun of the Velvet Underground. A highly over-rated band. Pretty good, but they get more credit than they deserve or need. Funny to see someone who's into VU get all skronky about Zappa. Then again, this is a place where The Cure gets a 80% approval rating...

Whatever David Kendall says, I guess...

herodotus wrote:Wow, almost 50/50!!

This shocks me, it really does. The man was perhaps the only real genius to have come out of the 60s american music scene.

Tell me, was Bartok "Crap"?

Was Varese "Crap"?

Is Boulez "Crap"?

I realize that he did a lot of not very funny songs like "Titties and Beer".
Does anyone realize that the guy had a family to support? And that millions of "crap" fans world wide loved these stupid songs?

Numerous people in this thread have made fun of the "You just don't understand it" statements of Zappa fans. What I want to know is why one of the great geniuses of american music is being talked about by people who don't even know what the fuck a polyrhythm is. You see, no other composers since Stravinsky have done polyrhythms more involved, interesting and groundbreaking. Not Ligeti. Not Nono. Not Stockhausen. Not Boulez. Not Xenakis. Not Elliot Carter. Not Robert Fripp.

This is important stuff. If it doesn't interest you, fine. If you don't 'get it', it doesn't make you stupid. I have nothing but respect for people who can write charming three chord pop songs. Zappa couldn't, thats for sure. But when a bunch of people make these really uninformed comments, and are really rude about a guy who broke boundaries that they don't even know exist, well.......

BTW, Slonimsky LOVED Zappas music.

Never heard of him? What a surprize.

And another

Herodotus... You're a good guy... But give it up, man. Most people are here because Albini recorded the Pixies and Nirvana, and this is their hub of safe MTV alternative music. If you try to go beyond that, you're a snob... Look at what happened when I mentioned that you might not like Zappa if your favorite band is The Sex Pistols?

So, while you are correct that many a highly regarded artist have regarded Zappa highly, your words are falling on mostly deaf ears.

Trying to get some of this crowd into good Zappa material is like trying to train a jackass to behave like a stallion.

My advice is to just make the best out of this situation. Play off the "alterna-fan" dynamic here, and do it only during down time at work. I made the mistake of getting passionate, and taking up some of my nights. What a waste. My passion for Zappa overwhelmed my good sense that you can bring a jackass to water, but you can't make it drink.

That said, let's talk about Jane's Addiction... One of the most remarkable alternative bands of all time. Yes. (and when I say "Yes", I may be alluding to the band "Yes", when talking of Jane's Addiction, and you may be one of the few who realize how accurate this is!)

Peace out bra'. You're a good man for sticking up for Zappa.

I'm a bit dissapointed in Dylan. He started this thread, and really didn't have one good thing to say about Zappa, long before I came into the picture. Having met Dylan on one occasion, I can say he's a good natured fellow, but I'm beggining to wonder why he's so concerned with his cyber-image and cyber-popularity... Maybe he's a fan of the Joe's Garage "cy-borg" stuff? I'll never know because he won't talk about Zappa at all. Nonetheless, props for starting the thread.

And, well, seeing as how he was so concerned about one fans dissaproval with a Cheer-Accident performance, it makes me wonder. Though I do still respect him quite a bit... I'm starting to think that the young woman with fingers in her ears is a Cheer-Accident employee, and that was one of their "happenings" they are so famous for.

But yeah, started the thread, and not one iota to say about Zappa's material, or even an indication that he even liked Zappa at all.

Anyway, good to hear someone stick up for Zappa, although you won't be popular 'round here for that.

Nuf said. Going home. Ba-bye...

Jesus. This thread actually makes me pine for the days when 'cum' was the most obnoxious, wounded poster around.

Wernehm_Zackariaah wrote:
Peace out bra'. ...

Staight up dawg, word to yo mutha, hizzow to tha nizzow albinizzow shizzow. nirvanizza zappaiza iza crappizza, ma bra. Straight outta cantonnizza, ohioizza.

Eubonics is crap.

Sorry for this to all the correct english speaking board members. I couldn't resist. Wasn't there a sarcasm poll somewhere?

This thread is getting creepy.

I'm not going to read it anymore.

The Mothers opened for the VU for a month or two when they were touring in California. Both bands had terrible things to say about the other, but Zappa would mess with them during their shows, saying "These guys really suck!" over the PA while they were playing. There was other stuff, but I will never find my back issues of What Goes On tonight. I do recall that some of it had to do with them both being on the same label, and there was only so much money to go around. Don't remember who got the better deal.

I did find some Lou Reed text that sums up his opinion at the time:

"He's probably the single most untalented person
I've heard in my life. He's two-bit, pretentious, academic, and he can't play rock 'n' roll, because he's a loser. And that's why he dresses up funny. He's not happy with himself and I think he's right."

Apparently the blood remained bad, and the Zappa family was not entirely thrilled that Reed was the one chosen to induct Zappa into the R&R hall of fame.

I wish I could find the Zappa quotes, because what I put up here looks lop sided the wrong way from what I remember.


Cher is quoted as saying the VU "....won't replace anything...except maybe suicide."
Another classic line.