That's a winner.
Re: Politics
2161We're headed for social anarchy when people start pissing on bookstores.
Re: Politics
2163Is it me, or do other people find the Palestinian protesters annoying at this point? Like, they got a meeting with Kamala Harris, and then shout at her while she's talking. I am against Isreal and their genocide against he Palestinian people, but there's a death toll going on around other countries, and we've got our own problems at home. They're focusing on a really narrow issue that doesn't directly effect people's lives in the US, and attacking only one party for it. I don't want the US to support Israel either, but in the big picture we've got mountains to fucking climb before we can get to addressing US imperialism. They should have been at the RNC, they should be at Trump rally's. Only targeting the Democrats, and then after being heard, continuing to be in their face seems really counter productive to me. I'm an ally and now I find them extremely obnoxious. Online discourse with these people is about as infuriating as trying to talk with MAGA. They are shooting themselves in the foot and firing at everyone else around them.
Re: Politics
2164It was the same in the UK. I’m exactly the same as you, it’s clearly a fucking travesty and yes our governments are enabling it. But disrupting the “left” during an election campaign can result in these groups being accused of caring more about the Middle East than their own communities. We got some literal Islamists in parliament last election.cakes wrote: Mon Aug 19, 2024 10:28 am Is it me, or do other people find the Palestinian protesters annoying at this point? Like, they got a meeting with Kamala Harris, and then shout at her while she's talking. I am against Isreal and their genocide against he Palestinian people, but there's a death toll going on around other countries, and we've got our own problems at home. They're focusing on a really narrow issue that doesn't directly effect people's lives in the US, and attacking only one party for it. I don't want the US to support Israel either, but in the big picture we've got mountains to fucking climb before we can get to addressing US imperialism. They should have been at the RNC, they should be at Trump rally's. Only targeting the Democrats, and then after being heard, continuing to be in their face seems really counter productive to me. I'm an ally and now I find them extremely obnoxious. Online discourse with these people is about as infuriating as trying to talk with MAGA. They are shooting themselves in the foot and firing at everyone else around them.
The reality is in the US or UK no electable government is going to change their position on the Israel/Palestine conflict. Israel is the ally in that part of the world all the protesting in the world isn’t going to move the dial.
I get the argument. “Hey centre left party, move your position on this or you lose our vote!”
Fine, but have you noticed the other guys? If you’re just going to help them get elected you’re just fucking yourself.
I’m on the Very Left, but the lack of Real Politick from fellow leftists is an endless problem. But it’s not the left if there’s not a massive circular firing squad of virtue signalling going on.
Last edited by Gramsci on Mon Aug 19, 2024 11:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
clocker bob may 30, 2006 wrote:I think the possibility of interbreeding between an earthly species and an extraterrestrial species is as believable as any other explanation for the existence of George W. Bush.
Re: Politics
2165Chicago has one of the largest Palestinian communities in the country. A lot of people are directly affected or are close with people who are directly affected. The protests are 100% necessary, whether people on the left like it or not.Gramsci wrote: Mon Aug 19, 2024 11:09 amIt was the same in the UK. I’m exactly the same as you, it’s clearly a fucking travesty and yes our governments are enabling it. But disrupting the “left” during an election campaign can result in these groups being accused of care more about the Middle East than their own communities. The reality is in the US or UK no electable government is going to change their position on the Israel/Palestine conflict. Israel is the ally in that part of the world all the protesting in the world isn’t going to move the dial.cakes wrote: Mon Aug 19, 2024 10:28 am Is it me, or do other people find the Palestinian protesters annoying at this point? Like, they got a meeting with Kamala Harris, and then shout at her while she's talking. I am against Isreal and their genocide against he Palestinian people, but there's a death toll going on around other countries, and we've got our own problems at home. They're focusing on a really narrow issue that doesn't directly effect people's lives in the US, and attacking only one party for it. I don't want the US to support Israel either, but in the big picture we've got mountains to fucking climb before we can get to addressing US imperialism. They should have been at the RNC, they should be at Trump rally's. Only targeting the Democrats, and then after being heard, continuing to be in their face seems really counter productive to me. I'm an ally and now I find them extremely obnoxious. Online discourse with these people is about as infuriating as trying to talk with MAGA. They are shooting themselves in the foot and firing at everyone else around them.
I get the argument. “Hey centre left party, move your position on this or you lose our vote!”
Fine, but have you noticed the other guys? If you’re just going to help them get elected you’re just fucking yourself.
I’m on the Very Left, but the lack of Real Politick from fellow leftists is an endless problem. But it’s not the left if there’s not a massive circular firing squad of virtue signalling going on.
Re: Politics
2166I reiterate.
Have you seen the other guys?
Protest, but respectfully, I’d suggest doing it when you’re not potentially just enabling a bunch of fascist weirdos.
Have you seen the other guys?
Protest, but respectfully, I’d suggest doing it when you’re not potentially just enabling a bunch of fascist weirdos.
clocker bob may 30, 2006 wrote:I think the possibility of interbreeding between an earthly species and an extraterrestrial species is as believable as any other explanation for the existence of George W. Bush.
Re: Politics
2167I bet people thought abolitionists were a bit much.
Justice for Randall Adjessom, Javion Magee, Destinii Hope, Kelaia Turner, Dexter Wade and Nakari Campbell
Re: Politics
2168It’s about timing not the actual issue.
The US is current in an election between centrist and literal fascists.
Saying you’re going to withdraw your support from the centrists because of this - highly important but - single issue in a First Past the Post system is a bad strategy when your are potentially helping elect something far worse on every level.
Even abolitionists and civil rights activists weren’t that dumb.
Just to make it clear, personally I completely agree with people protesting and advocating an end to that shitty dispute.
The US is current in an election between centrist and literal fascists.
Saying you’re going to withdraw your support from the centrists because of this - highly important but - single issue in a First Past the Post system is a bad strategy when your are potentially helping elect something far worse on every level.
Even abolitionists and civil rights activists weren’t that dumb.
Just to make it clear, personally I completely agree with people protesting and advocating an end to that shitty dispute.
clocker bob may 30, 2006 wrote:I think the possibility of interbreeding between an earthly species and an extraterrestrial species is as believable as any other explanation for the existence of George W. Bush.
Re: Politics
2169Their momentum is perfect. Let the people cook.
Justice for Randall Adjessom, Javion Magee, Destinii Hope, Kelaia Turner, Dexter Wade and Nakari Campbell
Re: Politics
2170They are only protesting the safe space of the democrats, who already have shown willingness to listen. It is unnecessarily derailing things, if it has any affect and it's become obnoxious because they seem to be missing the forest for the trees.Dave N. wrote: Mon Aug 19, 2024 11:17 am Chicago has one of the largest Palestinian communities in the country. A lot of people are directly affected or are close with people who are directly affected. The protests are 100% necessary, whether people on the left like it or not.