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Posted: **Sun Jun 06, 2021 3:39 pm**

I have to view the band as an abstract thing that exists outside of reality to enjoy music in some cases. Some problematic people include:

Pantera: Phil Anselmo
The Smiths: Morrissey
Morrissey: Himself
Metallica: Metallica
Megadeth: Dave Mustaine

I like a lot of Scandinavian metal but a lot of those dudes have pretty extreme views, like they haven't quite grasped that metal culture is supposed to be fun and a little tongue-in-cheek. And let's not forget the time the Foo Fighters were collectively high all the time and thought AIDS denial was a good idea.

Posted: **Sun Jun 06, 2021 5:09 pm**

ErickC wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 3:39 pm And let's not forget the time the Foo Fighters were collectively high all the time and thought AIDS denial was a good idea.

Wait, wait, they did what?! I need to hear more about this.

Posted: **Sun Jun 06, 2021 6:35 pm**

losthighway wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 5:09 pm
ErickC wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 3:39 pm And let's not forget the time the Foo Fighters were collectively high all the time and thought AIDS denial was a good idea.
Wait, wait, they did what?! I need to hear more about this.

They had a link to that alive & well thing on their webpage from around 2000-2008 and played some benefit shows: http://www.mtv.com/news/1429021/foo-fig ... -hiv-aids/

I think I read once that Nate explained it along the lines of "it sounded cool when I was high." Which makes me think of the HIGHdeas thread...

Posted: **Sun Jun 06, 2021 6:46 pm**

I'm a little hard pressed to think of any musicians where this has been an issue for me (I never much cared for Morrissey / Smiths, Danzig / Misfits or the Fall for example.) If I did I definitely think I'd be done listening to it, just because it'd be in my mind and hard to enjoy it. I guess Louis CK comes to mind as a guy that used to make stuff that I enjoyed, and now I feel like a a dick for admitting and having enjoyed that.

Posted: **Mon Jun 07, 2021 5:19 pm**

There is a certain guitar player from a certain band, a band that I like a lot, and said guitar player is a bit of an edge lord. I wish that I had not read any interviews with him, and I shall avoid reading any more. He will grow out of it I guess

Posted: **Mon Jun 07, 2021 5:56 pm**

BrendanK wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 6:46 pm I'm a little hard pressed to think of any musicians where this has been an issue for me (I never much cared for Morrissey / Smiths, Danzig / Misfits or the Fall for example.) If I did I definitely think I'd be done listening to it, just because it'd be in my mind and hard to enjoy it. I guess Louis CK comes to mind as a guy that used to make stuff that I enjoyed, and now I feel like a a dick for admitting and having enjoyed that.

I don't think there is anything wrong with enjoying stuff before you knew someone was a bad person in some way, shape, or form. It's do you continue to listen to or consume that art after the fact.

For me, if the person's offense is bad enough, the reminder of that offense swirls in my head while I hear the music. Then something that was once touching or exciting take on a new identity of the goodness that I love and the thought of the badness that happened.

Sometime, I'm even grossed out when I watch the Clint Eastwood Italian westerns because of what a tool Clint was/is. Other times, it doesn't bother at all and I take in the film and enjoy the atmosphere. There's definitely a spectrum involved.

Posted: **Mon Jun 07, 2021 10:36 pm**

Mason wrote: Thu Jun 03, 2021 11:56 am Van Morrison's deathbed pivot to hateful belligerent

Wait, what? No!

penningtron wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 8:10 am
speedie wrote: 25 posts in and no one has mentioned known Pedophile pants shitting draft dodger gun slinger Covid-denier-then-a-week-later-Covid-getter (months AFTER vaccine rollout) @Tednugent yet...
FYP

Wait, what? Yes!

Man, the things I've missed without the PRF.

For me it comes down to whether my perception of the artist's person(a) was a significant factor in my appreciation of the art. This is sometimes the case, but not always. E.g., I still love Burzum. I've always felt a little uneasy about it, but to me those records were never about Varg, who barely sounds human anyway; they're about whatever otherworldly feeling he was channeling. Perhaps I would see it differently if I spoke or read Norwegian, but when I've read translations there's nothing that would indicate the author is a Nazi piece of shit or require the listener to buy in. (That said, I bought all those albums secondhand for a reason.)

By contrast, Phil Anselmo is dead to me. His actions may be far less dangerous and ideological than Varg's, but they directly undermine and render hollow (ha) a large chunk of the lyrics and overall ethos that made Pantera so meaningful to me in my teens and early 20s.

I listened to a (Miuzi Weighs a) TON of Public Enemy last summer, as one does. Overall I find those albums have only gotten better with age and historical conditions, but the things that pissed me off BITD (particularly 'A Letter to the New York Post' and Griff's antisemitism) still piss me off. Maybe if Anselmo had provided my life-changing introduction to and 30-year continuing education in radical politics, I'd be inclined to cut him some slack too.

My favorite extant US black metal band, False, broke up last summer after multiple women accused one of the guitarists of sexual assault. It was a massive bummer (though infinitely more so for the victims, obviously) and I haven't tried to revisit their albums since. Their music is deeply personal for me, and I felt like they were part of an underground metal community that I respect. Sucks.

If anyone has any dirt on Ian MacKaye, keep that shit to yourselves.

Posted: **Mon Jun 07, 2021 11:27 pm**

The answer to the question is technically yes, but I'm also aware that bad people can have good ideas. People can draw the lines where they are comfortable, but I think you bring enough of your own perceptions and memories to the table when you experience a work that it would be wrong for me to moralize about you listening to a bad person's record.

Posted: **Tue Jun 08, 2021 1:18 am**

Isadore Nabi wrote: Mon Jun 07, 2021 10:36 pm
Mason wrote: Thu Jun 03, 2021 11:56 am Van Morrison's deathbed pivot to hateful belligerent
Wait, what? No!

penningtron wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 8:10 am
speedie wrote: 25 posts in and no one has mentioned known Pedophile pants shitting draft dodger gun slinger Covid-denier-then-a-week-later-Covid-getter (months AFTER vaccine rollout) @Tednugent yet...
FYP
Wait, what? Yes!

Man, the things I've missed without the PRF.

For me it comes down to whether my perception of the artist's person(a) was a significant factor in my appreciation of the art. This is sometimes the case, but not always. E.g., I still love Burzum. I've always felt a little uneasy about it, but to me those records were never about Varg, who barely sounds human anyway; they're about whatever otherworldly feeling he was channeling. Perhaps I would see it differently if I spoke or read Norwegian, but when I've read translations there's nothing that would indicate the author is a Nazi piece of shit or require the listener to buy in. (That said, I bought all those albums secondhand for a reason.)

By contrast, Phil Anselmo is dead to me. His actions may be far less dangerous and ideological than Varg's, but they directly undermine and render hollow (ha) a large chunk of the lyrics and overall ethos that made Pantera so meaningful to me in my teens and early 20s.

I listened to a (Miuzi Weighs a) TON of Public Enemy last summer, as one does. Overall I find those albums have only gotten better with age and historical conditions, but the things that pissed me off BITD (particularly 'A Letter to the New York Post' and Griff's antisemitism) still piss me off. Maybe if Anselmo had provided my life-changing introduction to and 30-year continuing education in radical politics, I'd be inclined to cut him some slack too.

My favorite extant US black metal band, False, broke up last summer after multiple women accused one of the guitarists of sexual assault. It was a massive bummer (though infinitely more so for the victims, obviously) and I haven't tried to revisit their albums since. Their music is deeply personal for me, and I felt like they were part of an underground metal community that I respect. Sucks.

If anyone has any dirt on Ian MacKaye, keep that shit to yourselves.

You quote me, yet talk no shit about Known Pedophile and pants- shitting draft dodger / gun slinging covid denying then getting covid utter fuckface @tednugent.

Posted: **Tue Jun 08, 2021 1:36 am**

See I didn't mention serial child rapist Ted Nugent because I've never found his music particularly good to begin with, so I just never bothered with it. I think I mentioned before that there are so many other bands of the era that are so much better that I never felt a need to listen to him, and, as a spillover bonus, I never had to rationalize his bullshit. I think the particular way I put it was "why should I listen to that mediocre jerkoff when someone like Neil Young is a better person and writes more interesting music in the first place?"

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