Premier Rock Forum

Andrew L,
I didn't get to read your post before I sent mine.

Como se dice? Ditto?

Si, ditto.

galanter wrote:I can't explain why anyone. let alone the EU, wouldn't consider Hezbollah a terrorist organization.

Maybe the EU has a history department. I already posted this:

During the course of Hezbollah's 17-year struggle with Israel along theLebanese/Israeli frontier in Southern Lebanon, it has never been established by any party directly involved (including the United Nations contingent on the ground) that the Party of God has perpetrated a single terrorist act against Israeli civilians." J. Palmer Harik, Hezbollah: The Changing Face of Terrorism (IB Tauris,2005), p. 2.

But, again, this isn't a defense of Hezbollah. It's a defense of known reality.

galanter wrote:Even if you have no sympathy of Israel, the best thing that could happen for Lebanon, not to mention the Palestinians, would be for Hezbollah to be disarmed.

No, it's about taking material goods when others aren't looking.

Galanter, The process by which the majority of the Lebanese people have come to believe Hezbollah is their salvation cannot be the same one by which it is disarmed. Israel's military actions cannot work in the long-run, as if Israel were the New York City police disarming urban gangs.

Even the mainstream media is making clear that Israel is alienating its natural, potential, and, increasingly, erstwhile, allies -- Muslim Lebanese not ordinarily drawn to Hezbullah, mainstream Iranians, Lebanese Christians. I'm sure the list will grow longer in the coming weeks.

Hezbollah not a terrorist organization?

I'm already over my time quota for EA, but I wonder if the EU history department took note of these...I used Wikipedia out of convenience, and I understand it's not a scholarly source...

1983 Beirut barracks bombing killing 241 American servicemen

1983 Bombing French multinational force headquarters which killed 58 French troops

April 18, 1983, suicide bombing of the United States Embassy The blast collapsed the front section of the embassy and killed 63 people.

September 20, 1984, another car bomb exploded at this embassy annex, killing 20 Lebanese and two American soldiers.

1985 June 14: TWA Flight 847 skyjacking, Hezbollah, see FBI Most Wanted Terrorists

1994 July 18: Bombing of Jewish Center in Buenos Aires, Argentina, kills 86 and wounds 300. Generally attributed to Hezbollah acting on behalf of Iran.

1994 July 19: Alas Chiricanas Flight 00901 is bombed, killing 21. Generally attributed to Hezbollah.

1994 July 26: Israeli Embassy Attack in London and a Jewish charity are car-bombed, wounding 20. Attributed by Britain, Argentina, and Israel to Hezbollah.



Also this -

The United Kingdom, Australia and the Netherlands officially list only the External Security Organisation of Hezballah (ESO) as a proscribed organisation.

The European Union does not list Hezbollah as a 'terrorist organization', but does list Imad Mugniyah, who is widely believed to be heading the international branch of the Hezbollah.

In a non-binding resolution adopted by the European Parliament on 10 March 2005, The EU Parliament considered that clear evidence exists of terrorist activities by Hezbollah and recommended that 'The EU Council should take all necessary steps to curtail them'. MEPs urged the EU Council to classify Hezbollah as a terrorist organisation. However, the Council is reluctant to do so.

galanter wrote:I'm already over my time quota for EA, but I wonder if the history department took note of these...copied from good old Wikipedia...

[url=http://www.theonion.com/content/node/50902]Wikipedia Celebrates 750 Years Of American Independence
Founding Fathers, Patriots, Mr. T. Honored[/url]

If you want to dispute any of the above facts please be specific.

galanter wrote:If you want to dispute any of the above facts please be specific.

Well for a start the Beirut barrack bombing was almost certainly carried out by the 'Free Islamic Revolutionary Movement'.

Egeland has heavily criticized Israel too...but this should be remembered...


UN accuses Hezbollah of 'cowardly blending'

Lauren Frayer, Canadian Press
Published: Tuesday, July 25, 2006

BEIRUT -- The UN humanitarian chief accused Hezbollah on Monday of "cowardly blending" in among Lebanese civilians and causing the deaths of hundreds during two weeks of cross-border violence with Israel.
The militant group has built bunkers and tunnels near the Israeli border to shelter weapons and fighters, and its members easily blend in among civilians.

Jan Egeland spoke to reporters at Larnaca airport in Cyprus late Monday after visiting Lebanon to co-ordinate an international aid effort. On Sunday, he toured the rubble of Beirut's southern suburbs, a once-teeming Shiite district where Hezbollah had its headquarters.

During that visit, he condemned the killing and wounding of civilians by both sides and called Israel's offensive "disproportionate" and "a violation of international humanitarian law."

On Monday, he had strong words for Hezbollah, which crossed into Israel, captured two soldiers and killed eight others on July 12, triggering fierce fighting.

"Consistently, from the Hezbollah heartland, my message was that Hezbollah must stop this cowardly blending . . . among women and children," he said. "I heard they were proud because they lost very few fighters and that it was the civilians bearing the brunt of this. I don't think anyone should be proud of having many more children and women dead than armed men."

"We need a cessation of hostilities because this is a war where civilians are paying the price," said Egeland, who was heading to Israel next.

galanter wrote:If you want to dispute any of the above facts please be specific.

I won't pick sides in any Arab/Israeli conflict other than the side of innocents being killed on all fronts.

All I'm saying is Wikipedia is not always the best source for information.