US GDP has officially been liberated. Trump's toadies will soon pick the dessicated carcass of America's economy. Also, hcain@of looks like old Billy Joel with hair.

Wood Goblin wrote: Thu Apr 03, 2025 9:41 am Less excusable is the platforming of “experts” who believe there is some greater strategy at work here. There isn’t. Trump is a moron.

I think it's plausible that part of the reason he's doing this is to tank the markets to benefit him/his rich friends. But nothing more complicated than that. I don't even think Trump has the capability to play checkers, let alone chess.

Krev wrote: Thu Apr 03, 2025 9:22 am I'm really surprised that Bezos allowed this. He must have given up on the retail side of Scamazon.

Apple will be hit extra hard by the tariffs, and of course "Tim Apple" was there at the inauguration kissing the ring with the rest of 'em.

I'm so happy my wife and I wrapped up last year with necessary big purchases in fear of tariffs. We tightened our belts and were lucky enough to wrap up some debt. So we're heading into this better off financially with all big purchases out of the way. If there's one thing that you can rely on Trump for, it's for being bat shit crazy.

What’s the vibe on the ground there in the US? I think maybe some people in industries like vehicle manufacturing are feeling pretty positive but for the average American this will be a clusterfuck.

Gramsci wrote: Thu Apr 03, 2025 11:18 am I think maybe some people in industries like vehicle manufacturing are feeling pretty positive but for the average American this will be a clusterfuck.

Well Jeep has already temporarily* laid off 900 workers and I'm sure there will be similar moves at other companies. No car in the US is possible without parts from Asia.

Of course the head of the Auto Union said something like "Thank you to the president for bringing back American Auto!" but he, along with the head of the Teamsters, are absolute dipshits.

*probably thinking Trump will once again back off this. This time, if left up to him, I'm not so sure.

Gramsci wrote: Thu Apr 03, 2025 11:18 am What’s the vibe on the ground there in the US? I think maybe some people in industries like vehicle manufacturing are feeling pretty positive but for the average American this will be a clusterfuck.

Considering the results of the special elections, trending toward anger. There's a huge nation-wide protest scheduled for Saturday. I'm assuming, maybe naively, that it's going to fuel this protest.

The senate voted 51-48 to cancel the tariffs. It needs to pass the house. We'll see how that goes, because they'd have to have enough votes to make it veto-proof. And that's if Mike Johnson allows it to come to the floor.

enframed wrote: Thu Apr 03, 2025 10:14 am

Wood Goblin wrote: Thu Apr 03, 2025 9:41 am It’s maddening to see the press repeating the marketing term “reciprocal tariffs,” but I suppose it’s not surprising.

But at least in part they are "reciprocal," meaning that other countries put tariffs on our goods, so we are "reciprocating." Am I misunderstanding?

I disagree that we should be doing this.

My job selling wine and spirits from Italy just got a more difficult.

Trump’s “tariff” numbers were complete fiction. Both the US and its trading partners have tariffs in place, though they vary by partner and by product. We are not being screwed.

He’s using the term “reciprocal” to make it sound like he didn’t start the trade war, when he very much did. It’s just as much bullshit as the term “preemptive strike” was during the Iraq War.

Gramsci wrote: Thu Apr 03, 2025 11:18 am What’s the vibe on the ground there in the US? I think maybe some people in industries like vehicle manufacturing are feeling pretty positive but for the average American this will be a clusterfuck.

I'm in my 39th year of working in the US steel industry. The place I'm at right now (I helped build it in 1991) is part of the largest flat rolled steel company in the US and this facility (when it's running full) makes 1.5 million metric tons of flat rolled steel a year, largely for exposed automotive and appliance applications. The hardest to make, highest value added, most surface critical stuff in our industry. We're fucked. Steel is a worldwide commodity and pricing is largely based on something we call "hot rolled coil". It's the basic starting point of any flat rolled steel process anywhere and is almost totally unusable by anyone outside the industry. The latest tariffs on steel and aluminum will (and have already) incrementally raised the price of HRC in the US which makes our cost look better on paper, but if no one is buying finished product like we make here starting with HRC, it does us no good. The tariffs just make the cost of HRC from outside the US more attractive and at the same time, they inflate the actual manufacturing costs of the stuff that does get used here. This mill I help roll should make 105,000 metric tons a month and we've struggled to get to 80,000 for the past 4 or 5 months and it's all because of demand, or lack of same. Those Stellantis layoffs in the US? A lot of those are at stamping plants we supply. Toyota is one of our chief customers and when they get impacted as they shortly will it's gonna be bad. Real bad.

I have heard that US Auto industry would shut down in a week. I sure hope so, to be honest. Not that I want the pain. It's just that we will never learn if it's not painful.