wow. i haven't been on the forum in awhile. i can't believe this thread has reached 25 pages! i only read the first 2 pages because it seems to me that it's the same old debate about selling out.

i'll say what i've said before on this topic...i will never understand what is so cool about being poor for the sake of your art?? being poor sucks. working shitty jobs that don't pay you any money and leave you tired so you can't produce your music/art sucks even more.

and, if there's any band that can be respected for maintaining a consistant career without "selling out," it's without a doubt Sonic Youth.

if i had to take a guess...i would assume those here that talk about "selling out" being uncool are on the younger side. in my early 20's, i didn't care about money either. all i needed was food, a bed and my band. well, that tune changes when you get into your 30's. suddenly, you REALLY need that expensive mattress because your back hurts. you need some decent food because ramen ain't gonna cut it anymore. and, who the hell wants to be paying rent when they're retired??

anyway, i don't know if SY is recording for Starbucks or what. but, if they are, i got nothing to say about it. yay, for them making a career out of playing music. yay, if they can put their kid through college. we should all be so lucky.

MrFood wrote:I mean... he's going for it man. He's really switched onto the whole MTV presenter mode. He's taking it really seriously. It's horrendous.

Ithink I saw that when it first aired. I always got the impression that he was satirizing the whole MTV presenter thing. I just re-watched it, and I still get that feeling.

Not being Thurston Moore or Beck, I don't know if he was serious, or being flippiand in a a way that convinces people he's being serious. Since I don't believe that Beck or Thurston are on this board, no one here can give a definitive answer as to what his intensions were.

Ben Adrian

hellyes!! wrote:if i had to take a guess...i would assume those hear that talk about "selling out" being uncool are on the younger side.

If I had to take a guess...I would assume that you have no idea who owns the message board you are posting on.

i know exactly whose board i am posting on. do you?

Sweet Movie wrote:

hellyes!! wrote:if i had to take a guess...i would assume those hear that talk about "selling out" being uncool are on the younger side.

If I had to take a guess...I would assume that you have no idea who owns the message board you are posting on.

Also, I think maybe this issue can be dissected further based on what your definition of "selling out" is. It's all about integrity. Just because band sells a song to Starbucks doesn't mean they have no integrity.

MrFood wrote:

hellyes!! wrote:if i had to take a guess...i would assume those hear that talk about "selling out" being uncool are on the younger side.

Every person under the age of about 23 that I've spoken to on this matter are completely fine with an artist 'selling out' or going commercial.

The industry has gotten smart enough to nip that shit in the bud at a young age.

Sorry, but the only people that care about this shit are dying out.

Well, then, who are all these people chiming in on the forum about how lame it is for bands "selling out"? My guess is that it's the 20-somethings. Not the under 23 people you mention. They are enough of a different generation to have completely different views because they were brought up in a mass media marketing machine (ie, Harry Potter movies released a week before the final Harry Potter book with Harry Potter action figures for sale at Borders a weeks before the movie comes out, only to be tied into drinking glasses at McDonald's, etc, etc).

I don't think it's the 30+ crew complaining about selling out. Most of us already know how hard it is to make money playing music and have suffered through shitty jobs to try to make it work.

hellyes!! wrote:i'll say what i've said before on this topic...i will never understand what is so cool about being poor for the sake of your art?? being poor sucks. working shitty jobs that don't pay you any money and leave you tired so you can't produce your music/art sucks even more.

You know what sucks even worse? Getting in bed with douchebags and acting like a douchebag yourself, excusing it under the pretext of not wanting to be poor, as if the only defense you have against ruin and starvation is corporate patronage.

There are a lot of honorable ways to earn a living. Nobody thinks being poor is awesome, and using that as a straw man is ridiculous.

steve wrote:

hellyes!! wrote:i'll say what i've said before on this topic...i will never understand what is so cool about being poor for the sake of your art?? being poor sucks. working shitty jobs that don't pay you any money and leave you tired so you can't produce your music/art sucks even more.

You know what sucks even worse? Getting in bed with douchebags and acting like a douchebag yourself, excusing it under the pretext of not wanting to be poor, as if the only defense you have against ruin and starvation is corporate patronage.

There are a lot of honorable ways to earn a living. Nobody thinks being poor is awesome, and using that as a straw man is ridiculous.

I think you guys are misunderstanding me. I'm not excusing doing whatever you please to make a buck. That's not at all what I am saying. I'm just saying is that I'm tired of people always arguing that if you even so much as get a straight job that you are "selling out."

And, for the record...I'm a librarian. I invested a lot of money into my education so I wouldn't have to be a corporate hag. I know all about making an honorable living.

hellyes!! wrote:i know exactly whose board i am posting on. do you?

I haven't been on these boards very long. I get the sense that some of the people who write stupid things are doing so because they are playing an online character of some kind.

I don't get that sense with you.

Sweet Movie wrote:

hellyes!! wrote:i know exactly whose board i am posting on. do you?

I haven't been on these boards very long. I get the sense that some of the people who write stupid things are doing so because they are playing an online character of some kind.

I don't get that sense with you.

You are correct. I am not playing any role here. There are at least a dozen people on this forum who know me in "real life." And, those people will be the first to tell you that I am not at all a "douchebag in bed with other corporate douchebags." I couldn't get further from it. I'm a children's librarian on the far southside of Chicago. I get my ass up everyday and drive through Englewood to go work in the hood with poor kids. This is the reason this issue irks me. I think people tend to be so black/white about what is "selling out."

Also, I should note...I was basing my comments off the first couple of pages of this thread in which there was some discussion about how being a graphic designer for a corporation is selling out. At a certain point, you just have to say, "Oh, come on!" We live in a capitalist society.