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My guess is that was pine tar.
My guess as to why he used the type of pine tar he did is beyond me.*
My guess on that is perhaps he's a dumbass.

* There are two popular forms of pine tar.
One comes in a brown liquid form that the batboy squeezes from a bottle into the rag before the game, rubs the rag together and creates a tacky paste to be applied to bats. (This is what we see on Biggio's helmet every year, George Brett's bat in Yankee Stadium and 90% of every wood bat in pro baseball.)

Another kind comes in a glue-stick form. It is a clearer substance that you'll sometimes see the on-deck players rubbing onto the handle. This is the kind he should've used on his palm.

If it happens to be wet already, from rain, for example, or from being dropped on the wet grass, then that's okay.

It's not okay. In rainy conditions, a batted ball is never returned to the pitcher. The ump removes the wet ball that was just in play and gives the pitcher a dry one. Even when it's not raining, an ump will inspect the ball that was just in play to be sure no scuffs are on it before giving it back to the pitcher.

Also, a good "spit" ball is one thrown with a specific spot on the ball altered - whether it be a scuff from a brick wall, shoe polish from a foul ball or a dab of Vaseline. A ball that is entirely wet (from rain, for instance) will not move unnaturally because the entire surface area of the ball is wet.
It will be removed from the game, however, because a wet ball is easier to scuff (with fingernails, a hidden rock in your glove, etc...)

In order for a ball to move unnaturally, it must be thrown specifically.

It's a common misnomer that the slickness from Vaseline on the finger somehow enables the pitcher to make the ball dart to the left or right with Wiffle Ball like movement. This is false for the same reason that a scuffed ball (with no Vaseline on it) is able to achieve the same Wiffle Ball like movement.

It's the slight addition (a dab of Vaseline), or the slight subtraction of the surface of the ball (scuff) that alters the aerodynamics of the ball - eliciting an erratic ball flight/movement. Pitchers will place the foreign substance or the scuff on the left side of the ball while throwing a two-seam something/"fastball."

The result is an altered ball that will dive unnaturally to the right... Or to the left if the scuff or Vaseline dab is placed on the right side of the ball upon delivery.

The bigger the dab/deeper the scuff, the more aerodynamically unsound the ball becomes bringing on a more pronounced movement.

What Rogers did last night was try to get some stickiness in his fingers everytime he cupped his hand to blow on it to combat the slickness of the ball. This isn't anything new. It's illegal, but hardly novel.

What was novel, was his using the darker liquidy tar like a dumbass, instead of the clearer brand.

You can't blame him though. He is, afterall, a cameraman attacking dumbass - with great command of the strikezone.

If Moises Alou can piss on his hands why can't The Gambler have shit on his hands?

Pissing on your hands won't aid in altering anything but your buddies' perception of you. Shitting on your hands could make a ball move if you dabbed that shit on the ball and threw it the right way.

I would watch a band called Dabs of Shit.

My brother was in a band called Ball of Shit on the Dabb. The Dabb is a river in a fictional novel by Alfonse Pendergrass..who loves wet balls. The Ball of Shit was not, but should have been, Kenny Rodgers.

6-4-3 makes a salient point, which I would like to make again, as if I am the first to make it.

There's a distinction between putting stuff on the ball and putting stuff on one's hands. Not in the rule book, perhaps, but practically speaking. Rosin, for example, is made available to pitchers primarily b/c it provides some 'grippiness' without becoming sticky or caking readily--therefore, the thinking goes, it allows the pitcher to do his thing w/o getting shit on the ball.

I forget who it was, who used to put a big pile of rosin in his pitching hand and release his 'rosin ball' in a cloud of dust. That technique didn't last very long.

Anyway, everyone knows guys do this kind of thing, esp. in cold and/or wet weather, and I believe it is considered a venal sin in most baseball circles. Fatasses like Jay Mariotti think it's the end of the world, of course.

I realize I am on thin ice correcting the baseball knowledge of a former professional player, but 6-4-3, spit and grease are used differently than scuffing.

I learned as a child how to throw a spitball. You spit on the ball so there's a wet, slippery area under your fingers, or spit on your fingers and rub them together with your thumb, making a blob of spit. When you throw the ball, you grip the leather rather than the seams and try to squeeze the ball (putting pressure on the slippery area under your fingers), rather than releasing it. It releases itself by poppping out of your hand with almost no spin, like a knuckleball. That's why it is hard to hit.

The forkball uses the same principle, as described in The Physics of Baseball, a fine book.

You're right on the money with the scuffing however.

As to why he used the brown tar, I think he probably did it at the last minute, absent-mindedly, when therre was no glue-stick at hand.

petercobber wrote:Kenny Rodgers.

Maybe there is some shit on your hand that prevents you from spelling the guy's name correctly?

It wasn't dirt. A pitcher of Rogers's stature does not "accidentally" get an admixture of dirt, rosin, and spit on his pitching hand the size of a turd.

I think it was handled well by LaRussa. He didn't make a big stink about it, and the game went on. LaRussa well knows what big league pitchers do, and have done, for over 100 years. And what they do is cheat, often in the most hilarious ways. (Just ask Gaylord Perry.) It's long been documented, if not accepted, as being part of the game. Unethical? Sure. But who cares. It's the big leagues...you either handle it or get back on the bus to Iowa.

Hooray for cheating.

Iodine will stain flesh like there's no tomorrow. If it was still wet, it would help a pitcher in the 'portion of the ball being wet aspect, would it not?

La Russa's comments in this article seem to address the argument that he knows everyone (including his own pitchers) use substances to improve grip, and why he didn't press the issue.

"I know that pitchers use some sticky stuff to get a better grip, from the first throw in spring training to the last side in the World Series. Just because there's a little something that they're using to get a better grip, that doesn't cross the line."

Interesting interview with Gaylord Perry in today's SunTimes here:
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/slezak/1 ... 24.article

You spit on the ball so there's a wet, slippery area under your fingers, or spit on your fingers and rub them together with your thumb, making a blob of spit. When you throw the ball, you grip the leather rather than the seams and try to squeeze the ball (putting pressure on the slippery area under your fingers), rather than releasing it. It releases itself by poppping out of your hand with almost no spin, like a knuckleball. That's why it is hard to hit

It is possible to do this, so I've heard, but not the norm. In my experience, I never played in a league where every scuffed ball was taken out of play. High school, college and the minor leagues all save dough by not having 300 brand new balls for every game.

My friends who were pitchers were mastercraftsmen at throwing scuffed ball pitches. It is taught at every level. In college, we had a brick wall behind home plate. I remember guys deliberately throwing wild pitches in between innings so as to give the ball a good scuff. The wild pitch ended up back in the ump's pocket and the pitcher would wait to get it back after a foul ball into the parking lot.
OR... knowing that the ump had the scuffed ball, he would wait till a critical moment in an at-bat came up and ask the ump for a new one - sometimes two, three times, till he got the scuffed ball back. Then came the circus-pitch.

While it's possible to throw a traditional spitter as you did, most of the time it is thrown as I described above - by altering the ball's aerodynamics through addition or subtraction.

One guy I played with used to line the inside of his cup with KY jelly. When needed he would turn to the outfield, reach in and pretend to adjust his cup and come out with the "funny." It was then applied precisely on the ball while in his glove getting the sign and the hitter had no chance.

This is easily done as there are no second base umpires in college and lower minor leagues to be able to watch what the pitcher's doing inside his glove from behind.

Also, in college and the minor leagues, the ball boy supplying the ump with new balls is the home team's bat boy or clubhouse manager. It was common for our pitcher to grab two or three balls, go into the bathroom and make a small cut with a razor blade along the side of the ball. He'd hand them back to the ball boy and tell him to bring them to the ump in between innings before he went back out.

This was always preferrable to running the risk of being caught with KY jelly or Vaseline on your person. The scuff can be explained. Vagisil on your cock-protector can't.

Salut baseball and all who've fudged the rules since its inception!