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monkeybob wrote:

Antero wrote:There's a distorted rhythm tone in "I'll Take My..." and "Impossible" that's really thin and unfocused. If I was guessing, I'd say it was a Strat with a distortion pedal with the drive up too high - it's all going spreading OUT instead of FORWARD, if you catch my meaning?

On "I'll take My chances" do you mean the guitar in the left or the right? There's only two guitars on there, each panned about 50% each way. There's only two guitars on "Impossible" too, but they're not so clearly seperated.

Err... I'm not actually sure, as I might have crossed wires when I was setting up my speakers. On "I'll Take My Chances" there's the one guitar with the clearer, more biting tone that goes "danahnahnahnah" and the thin distorted guitar replies "doo-doo-doo-doo."

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The source of the sound of an 'artist's' tools should be an entirely subjective matter - one that only the artist can make concrete judgements upon.

That the internet and guitar shops, and muso-bars the world over are full of teen-to-retirement age men bickering about which guitars and which amps sound 'best', as if there is a 'best' in the context of what is supposed to be art is not much short of pathetic.

Also ultra-ironic on this forum of all places, given Steve's sadly extraordinary refusal to adhere to the banal, guitar-sound-wise.

Guitarists are CRAP.

The source of the sound of an 'artist's' tools should be an entirely subjective matter - one that only the artist can make concrete judgements upon.

That the internet and guitar shops, and muso-bars the world over are full of teen-to-retirement age men bickering about which guitars and which amps sound 'best', as if there is a 'best' in the context of what is supposed to be art is not much short of pathetic.

Agree 100% Champion rabbit. Gear is a means to an end, simply a tool. Although it's worth knowing about your tools, and there's nothing wrong with being interested in the way they work, at the end of the day it's the music you produce that's important. I'll play a plastic guitar from Toys R Us if it sounds right in the song.

Err... I'm not actually sure, as I might have crossed wires when I was setting up my speakers. On "I'll Take My Chances" there's the one guitar with the clearer, more biting tone that goes "danahnahnahnah" and the thin distorted guitar replies "doo-doo-doo-doo."

The first guitar on "I'll Take My Chances" (the clearer one, should be on the left) is me playing a Tele through my Crate Powerblock using a Boss Overdrive. The second replying guitar (the thinner one on the right) is the other guitarist playing a 1964 Jazzmaster through a Peavey Classic 30 valve. I think he's just using the overdrive channel, no other pedals. I think that the main reason his guitar sounds thinner is because my amp had two mics on it, while his only had one. Next time we record I definitely want to work on miking the amps better, but it's a bit of a black art!

and of course bear in mind that everything sounds shit through myspace. We would set them to a download, but we want to try and get them on itunes.

Champion Rabbit & monkeyblob - you guys are so deluded!

Everybody knows if you can't make your guitar sound like Angus Young you are shit! This is not subjective - this is fact.

Hey CR, are you suggesting that a bunch of stomp boxes through a solid state amp like a Crate is not the most banal guitar setup out there?

Sure the Gibson through vintage Marshall tube amp or Fender through vintage Fender tube amp is up there, as they've been proven to produce some great tones, but without any data to back this up, I'm guessing the string of pedals (most of them Boss) through a cheap solid-state amp is probably the single most ubiquitous guitar rig on the planet.
This is probably because it is the cheapest to produce (and thus cheapest to buy) and requires the least understanding of how to apply technique to generate tone, allowing the guitarist to rely on pedals.

And please know that I'm not suggesting that nobody can play pedals well... cause lots of great guitarists do.

Banal. Art. You talk funny!

scott wrote:Sure the Gibson through vintage Marshall tube amp or Fender through vintage Fender tube amp is up there, as they've been proven to produce some great tones, but without any data to back this up, I'm guessing the string of pedals (most of them Boss) through a cheap solid-state amp is probably the single most ubiquitous guitar rig on the planet.
This is probably because it is the cheapest to produce (and thus cheapest to buy) and requires the least understanding of how to apply technique to generate tone, allowing the guitarist to rely on pedals.

So Scott, does it therefore follow that someone playing boss pedals through a cheap solid state amp cannot be a good guitarist? Does it follow that they are not going to produce any decent guitar sounds?

So what if a guitarist's set up is banal? Who cares as long as they are playing interest sounding music?

Oh, and just in case we're still talking about my setup, I don't own any boss pedals...

I like gear, I like talking about it. Most guitarists do.

I don't, and have never seeked The Rock Tone.

And the thing is, it's predominantly in how you play your instrument. There are numerous stories of cool guitarists plugging in to foreign pieces of shit and in spite of this they sound like they usually do.

Conversely, you can give a variety of guitarists an SG and a Marshall and you'll get some widely varied sounds.

I don't know of any guitarists that I like who talk in terms of "best" sound. Idiotic.

scott wrote:Hey CR, are you suggesting that a bunch of stomp boxes through a solid state amp like a Crate is not the most banal guitar setup out there?

Just saying that it's a shame that something (the electric guitar) so potentially ripe for experimentation and with such scope for variety has been reduced in a matter of decades to something that can sound right or wrong.

I'm suggesting that guitarists talking about amps and guitars as if there is an objective truth relative to what is 'good' and 'bad' is pathetic, and that's what guitarists do all the time. Everywhere.

Champion Rabbit wrote:I'm suggesting that guitarists talking about amps and guitars as if there is an objective truth relative to what is 'good' and 'bad' is pathetic, and that's what guitarists do all the time. Everywhere.

Champion Rabbit wrote:Some music is good, some is bad; no point searching reasons.

Huh.

Champion Rabbit wrote:Just saying that it's a shame that something (the electric guitar) so potentially ripe for experimentation and with such scope for variety has been reduced in a matter of decades to something that can sound right or wrong.

I'm suggesting that guitarists talking about amps and guitars as if there is an objective truth relative to what is 'good' and 'bad' is pathetic, and that's what guitarists do all the time. Everywhere.

Your tone must suck.