Hi folks

I'm thinking about stepping up the recordings I do at home. At the moment I just use a 4 channel mixer into a minidisc recorder so no multitracking, the mics are pretty shitty and although its good for demo-ing stuff it doesn't give enough control to be able to get good recordings that I'd be happy to call "finished".

so I want to get some cheap equipment and your opinions would be gratefully received.

I need 8 tracks minimum - I can't see when I'll need many more, but I do need the facility to record 8 tracks simultaneously. which brings in the question of mics - I know a lot of companies do sets of mics, are any of these any good? is there a simple way to get a versatile range of good quality mics. I'm no fetishist so I want to make it simple and easy to use.
same goes for a desk, nothing more than I need. ditto for outboard gear - if any.

so what do people have at home at the moment? whats good and whats bad?

sorry this is vague. I'm a guitar player, microphones scare me and recording tends to make my ass cheeks clench but I want to see this through.

cheers
chris

hey, here's some ideas of setups if you're wanting to get a decent budget computer based studio.

soundcards/interfaces: check out the presonus firestation or motu 828mkII...both are 8in/8out, have 2 mic preamps built in, and are firewire. if you don't have firewire, the motu 2408mkIII is a good option, but more expensive....just get a firewire adapter card.

mixers: research the behringer eurorack mx 3242X - 8 direct outs to interface to the card, plus built-in effects (to avoid the outboard units). also, mackie makes the 1604 vlz pro, which is basically the same unit without the effects, but with mackie quality preamps...which you will pay more for.

mics: try the audix drum mic kit - maybe those reading this would disagree, but a friend of mine recorded a nationally distributed (and good!) cd using these for drums. for vocals, try the studio projects c1 or rode nt-1A.

monitors: ive heard good things about the behringer truth monitors, and ive heard the m-audio studiophile bx5's...they're a good inexpensive solution.

remember, this is budget, but still gonna run you about $1500-$2000. but it will be a HUGE improvement, and you're software will offer you control like you cannot get on your minidisc. don't forget to research recording software. this may not be a 2" studer with some $30k analog automated control console or whatever, but this is the real world, and we make what we have work! bubye-

You need two very important things:

1. A nice comfy room, with some nice chairs. Whatever floats your boat to make a comfortable room, and to hell with acoustics. Some suggestions: beanbags, futons, batiques, tapestries. Tasty lights- say four ceiling mounted with individual switching.

2. One really nice mic. Alternatively, one really wierd mic. Mine's a Coles 4038 which fits both categories. The AKG C3000 and its relatives are good. Spend as much as you can, but use your ears. Just coz it's industry standard, doesn't mean it's good. For example, the AKG C414 and the neumann U87 are not as good as people say. This is because a lot of them haven't lived with them.

Then you need a place to put your speakers, and good speakers. But there's plenty info around about that stuff, so go Google. I recommend Paul White's little books, they're simple and pragmatic. Anything by Craig Anderton is also worth checking out.

1. Do not ever give the Behringer company your money. I understand that have been accused of and sued for blatently copying circuit designs, product ideas and designs, etc, from other companies and selling their versions of the equipment for far less than the equipment they copied. This makes them a truly evil corporation.

2. Great mics are the most important thing. Audio Technica and Beyer make some great mics that are way less expensive than comparable mics by Neumann, AKG, etc.

3. Don't listen to that man. The 414 and U87 are as good as people say.

best
Bob Weston

I second Bob on all points.

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC

I understand people keep repeating this, but it is very important. Buy good gear first rather than going cheap. It's nicer to have less gear that's great than a lot of mediocre crap. I made that mistake.

Second, look for gear that might do one thing really well rather than being super flexible at the expense of quality. I've done tons of recordings on a mackie with ADATs. It's an inexpensive way to learn what works and what doesn't, to cut your teeth. Now I have a job at a studio where I work with top notch gear all the time, I'm realizing how this very flexible gear can compromise sound quality by trying to meet a features-to-price point ratio. I'm thinking about re-doing my home studio with simpler gear that sounds better. Maybe things like a quality 8 track, a few good preamps, and a simple board. Like what I started with, but not crap this time.

414s. I've had one for a long time. I used two today to mic a piano. They work great for some things but are not so hot for others.

And remember, you can still make great music with crap! See flying saucer attack.

ben adrian
typo king

ok, i have to respond to some of the recent posts on this thread, and at the same time share what i think of this forum. hopefully i can sum this up in a few points and not waste too much of everyone's time.

1. i believe that the responses ive been given to a thread i started, in addition to other responses ive seen to posts, are really impractical to the originators needs, and people need to think about this before responding. example: i posted a thread asking if anyone had any sites that could give info on time code sync....the response...buy a studer 2" 24 track!! what the hell?!? example 2: in this post, the originator is upgrading a stereo minidisc recorder, and wants "some cheap equipment". i suggested an entire setup for right around 2 grand (which might even be too expensive for him!), and the following 2 responses said to get a u87.
a u87! ....$2200 on its own!!!

2. America is a capitalist country, and i believe the free market is what made this country prosperous yet gave opportunity. i also believe that intellectual property rights are important, and that design integrity is as well. i however think that companies like behringer, art, etc. have brought much needed competition into the audio gear market, and if behringer is an evil company for making near exact replicas of mackies, etc..., wouldn't that just expose just exactly how "evil" mackie is for selling the stuff so expensive to begin with!!

3. Talented engineers and talented bands make good records. ive heard a recording that was skillfully done using a soundblaster card with noise reduction filtering through a hi-fi vcr as well as absolute crap using a digi001 (don't get me started on digidesign, the microsoft of the audio world)----------anyway, i think its about time we hear from more people, like me, who have a setup that's under $10 cagillion dollars and are trying to acquire the same skill that makes studios such as electric so well respected. sorry, this took longer than i thought, and i don't mean any disrespect to people i don't even know. we all are learning here, let's try and communicate on a similar level. later

Hi itchy,

You mis- read my post, which was the second one. I was making an issue of NOT buying expensive gear, and gave the U87 as an example. I was trying to focus the original poster on issues other than gear. The more important ones, like comfort. I was in fact, making an issue of NOT BUYING ANY GEAR AT ALL. I wanted to get people thinking about what they wanted to create. I'm sick of people saying "O, I can't release my album until I get a good vocal mic" or whatever. It's about people, and people who like songs!

Mackie, Beyerdynamic etc. aren't ripping anyone off with what they charge. Behringer can sell at those prices because they steal R&D from other companies. This is a significant cost because to do it you must employ smart people for long periods of time. So it's still about people.

So your mistaken in your criticism of the board. The communication problem is entirely yours. but you do have the right idea about talented people, so I think you will understand what I'm saying (if you read it).

hey swordfish,

sorry, you misread my communication as well. i know you were saying not to check out u87 like everyone else said, so my response was not directed toward you at all. and i really thought your comments about atmosphere and room design were cool. my room just got faux-painted a dark color, gives it kind of a serious, dark vibe(oooh, scary)....

-anyway, i'm sure we could all argue behringer's legitimacy as a company all day long, and noone would win. its a waste of t-1 bandwidth. however, while they're around, I'm gonna take advantage of the bottom end they ripped out of the gear market! ----

-besides, they're definitely not the first to do this. ibanez began by copying les paul's and strats. i have a les paul copy from 1977 that i just love - they resell now in mint condition for about $1000...and mine was free! univox also copyed guitars, and i have one of theirs too - a 60's les paul junior copy, and it has better clean tone to me than any other guitar ive played! so unless everyone who reads this wants to contribute $3 to the "get eric some legitimate gear" fund, just leave me and my ripoffs alone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

see yaaaaaa!

>>-anyway, i'm sure we could all argue behringer's legitimacy as a company all day long, and noone would win. its a waste of t-1 bandwidth. however, while they're around, I'm gonna take advantage of the bottom end they ripped out of the gear market!

obviously, you're free to do as you wish

but there's no argument regarding behringer's shittiness

the fact is that otto behringer is a fucking sleazebag, and his company sucks

when you rip off circuits part for part, including layouts and PARTS THAT AREN'T DOING ANYTHING, you are a sleazebag, and you deserve nothing anyone gives you

>>-besides, they're definitely not the first to do this. ibanez began by copying les paul's and strats.

there is a massive difference between ripping off every detail of a complicated circuit and copying the general shape of something

i mean, buy what you wanna buy, but just be aware of whose pockets you are lining: a first-class fucker

i offer this opinion as a private citizen. please insert 'i think' anyplace i call anyone names.