So, I ran into a bit of an odd issue. I bought a used J Mascis JM a year or so ago and when it arrived it was trashed. I took it to a tech to get fixed and they fixed a gouge in the fretboard, changed a fret near the nut, did some fancy minor neck shaving to improve the break angle, and then set it up. I didn't play it much due to health issues, but a few months back I picked it up and started to notice the tuning was out on the lower frets. I figured it was the truss rod shifting with the weather (as suggested by the tech) so I tweaked it and put on new strings. Since then, the EAD strings are fine, but no matter what I do with the truss road and saddles the G, B and kind of the E strings are always a few cents sharp in the first 3-4 frets while the saddles are as far back as they can go. The G is the worst, being 2-3 cents out.
I took it to the tech and he looked it over and said that even after my messing with the truss road the setup was still great, the relief was as low as it could go, and ultimately it's a problem with the design of the guitar, that this is a common issue with guitars and the best solution (without moving the bridge) is to install a compensated nut.

I understand what he's talking about to a degree - that guitars are never perfectly in tune - but this seems like a much bigger issue, no? The guitar is unplayable. The only way to have the chords not sound bad is to tune the g and b flat a few cents, but in that case open chords sound wrong too. Are the G and B strings supposed to just naturally be this sharp on a JM?
Like, these are popular guitars and I've never heard anyone talk about it being this much of an issue.

I have this exact problem with my Ric. Perfect intonation at 0 vs 12, but all the cowboy chords sound fucked up. It's very likely a defective (read: badly cut) nut. If the slots don't angle "uphill" moving from the headstock towards the fretboard, the string is actually making contact at the back edge of the nut, rather than right at zero. This throws off the scale length by a few mm on the strings with bad slots. But you intonate with the open string so it sounds fine until you fret those first few frets.

Edit: you might be able to correct it with a pro nut file- just file the proper angle into every slot. As long as they aren't already cut too deep on the fretboard edge which could lead to buzzing.

jeff fox wrote: Tue Jan 31, 2023 7:33 pm I have this exact problem with my Ric. Perfect intonation at 0 vs 12, but all the cowboy chords sound fucked up. It's very likely a defective (read: badly cut) nut. If the slots don't angle "uphill" moving from the headstock towards the fretboard, the string is actually making contact at the back edge of the nut, rather than right at zero. This throws off the scale length by a few mm on the strings with bad slots. But you intonate with the open string so it sounds fine until you fret those first few frets.

Edit: you might be able to correct it with a pro nut file- just file the proper angle into every slot. As long as they aren't already cut too deep on the fretboard edge which could lead to buzzing.

Had an Electra Les Paul copy that did this as well.

One thing that someone could try even though I had my doubts when it is a certain degree of "Out Of Whack..."

That Peterson "StoboStomp..." family of tuners. There is a "Standard Tuning..." preset that is calibrated to attempt to get everything about as in tune as it can be all at once.

Never was sure that it could overcome something that was like you are describing, but I was always curious about how much it might mitigate the issue.

andyman wrote: Tue Jan 31, 2023 4:15 pm Are the G and B strings supposed to just naturally be this sharp on a JM?

No. You should be able to play open E to open G and not want to smash the thing. I think this has to be a badly cut nut?

Re: the nut, that was my first thought but the guy said the action is about as low as it'll go without buzzing. It looks pretty low, in fairness.

It's not about low action, it's about scale length. Jeff did a good job of describing it above. If the nut-to-string contact point is biased one way or the other (either toward the headstock or the 1st fret), your scale length doesn't divide correctly at the fret. You intonate the open string, but when you fret it near the nut, the fret-to-bridge distance isn't what's required to produce an in-tune note.

The tech actually chimed in over on tfb.

(photos in thread)

He did try filing down the back of the g slot to little/no avail.

That nut is nasty anyway. If it were me i'd cut a new, regular nut and see if that fixes anything.

Yeah, I can actually SEE the gaps under the G and B strings in the nut, so while he might have filed the back edge, there's still probably a hump in the middle somewhere. Should be a knife edge.

The tech's highly revered so I'm hesitant to throw accusations around.