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Buckle up, this is long:

So, I have a new band that uses a "drum machine." Of course, we don't actually use a classic drum machine. I program drums on the computer and then we play back those programmed drum tracks. Now, I quite enjoy the "artificial drummer" world, but I'm having a difficult time finding a really good and satisfying work flow.

I used to be in many bands with a drum machine. I used hardware drum machines because that was the only game in town. Generally, I'd set up one drum kit. Then I'd program the songs using the built in interface. The physical drum machine was also the live playback device. This didn't happen often, but sometimes I'd need to tweak a drum level (like make the kick louder), or maybe switch out what snare sample that I wanted. I could do that in the drum kit setup on the drum machine hardware. Then, that change was in the playback of every song. The only issue was drum machine memory if I wanted a lot of variation in the patterns. So yeah, one device, sometimes a little clunky, was the entire workflow.

For backup, I'd make a CD-r with the recorded drum tracks, and I'd bring a little battery operated discman. In a pinch, that would get me through a show. That battery operated discman became an iPod. After a bit of time, the iPod was getting used as the primary live device and the hardware drum machine was the "backup".

Then I had a period of working with real drummers However, I'd still demo music at home and I got used to programming drums in a DAW. When it came time to do this new band, I did a bunch of demos with programmed drums. I expected to find a real drummer, but the bassist and I never clicked with anyone. I also like the idea of having a super portable band.

So, the demos got fleshed out. The drum patterns got more complicated. The demo guitar takes got muted and rerecorded as final takes. Vocals were added. Poof, finished recordings emerged from the demo files.

So now the drum tracks for live use are the finished recordings with the rest of the instrument tracks muted. There are also some differences like removing some of the drum dynamics and some of the "room mics" of the drum plug in. Those just don't work so well when cranking into a punk rock club.

Doing the drum machine this way has opened up a host of new problems to be solved. Are all the drum track songs leveled properly? Is the kick/snare mix that worked for the recording now correct for live playing? What playback device do I use for the most fool-proof live performance; iPad, sampler, looper, computer, etc? What's the easiest work flow if I find I need to change something?

I know what the core of the problem is. In the olden days, recording was rare. The drum machine was programmed to be our live drummer replacement. All the tools were made to perform well in a live setting. When it came time to record, we might have doctored the drum machine, but it ended up on the tape and could not be tweaked once the recording was mixed and finished. Now, hardware drum machines as one-stop-shops don't really exist anymore. Drums are done on computer demos, and the demos become the recording. The drums were never really created with the intent of being used in live performance, but rather to make the recording as good as it could be. I need a workflow to bring it back to live, and to make it as reliable as possible.

Our one show that we have played so far happened before we recorded. The demo drums were spit out to MP3s, and I used an iPad backing track player (through a mobile interface). It was fine.. a bit fiddly.

Here's my best idea so far. Bounce out the drums, level them all in one DAW session. Re-render the leveled drum files. Load the files into a looper pedal with memory capability (the bassist has an RC-30). Use that to quickly select songs and play them back with a single button press.

The other idea that I had was to just get an old-style drum machine that can do patterns and songs and simply have the "live version" of the band with that setup... like I did 20+ years ago. It's a bit willfully retro, but I'm not necessarily against that.

Anyway, if you had to do this, how would you perform with drum machine or drum tracks live, knowing that you'd be in places with questionable PAs and where things could get rough or damaged?

benadrian wrote: Here's my best idea so far. Bounce out the drums, level them all in one DAW session. Re-render the leveled drum files. Load the files into a looper pedal with memory capability (the bassist has an RC-30). Use that to quickly select songs and play them back with a single button press.

Before reading through all that this was gonna be my suggestion. It might take some trial and error to find optimal samples and balances because you're right: they'll probably need to be mixed way more dry/transient heavy/close mic'd sounding for the live thing. And even though those pedals have stereo in/outs I'd probably opt for mono live.

Well, there's a few ways to do it..

With a drum machine.

Elektron do some good boxes, that can be very complicated if you want or need that flexibility.

Arturia Drumbrute has a bunch of sounds with individual outputs which makes level adjustment quicker and easier than doing it in the box. There's also the Drumbrute impact which has a few less sounds.

If you can live with the self loathing (j/k) there's a few roland classics that have been kinda cloned by behringer and if budget is an issue the RD-6 (TR606 clone) is very cheap.

p.s. bonus points if you render the live drums 10-20bpm faster to mimic overexcited human drummers

I don't use it for this specific role, but I love the Blackbox sampler, and it would work well:

Boss RC-5 if you want compact, easy file track management, mountains of storage.

mdc wrote: Tue Jan 16, 2024 5:55 pm Boss RC-5 if you want compact, easy file track management, mountains of storage.

Yeah, RC-30 on the way, but it only accepts 44.1/16 files. How quaint!

You know, none of this would be an issue if you just moved back to L.A.

I mentioned it in the „what are you buying“ thread, I bought a B Beat playback thing. 6 outputs with volume control, everything can easily be arranged on the computer. It’s pretty great. You can have your entire set run through or use a foot switch to start and stop it. You could also add video or images to sync with your set and send midi information synced to the music…….

https://www.thomannmusic.ch/m_live_b.be ... gKl1vD_BwE

I hadn't seen that before - very cool! Looks like a good replacement for that cymatic box that no longer exists.