Weirdly started on this thought train by listening to Cockney Rejects - oi oi oi. Got me thinking of how reducing the oi genre in all its awfulness was. Punk stripped out and simplified rock, then oi took the boring plodding early 80s Brit punk thing and made it even simpler - musically and lyrically (a rare feat!)

Got me thinking of other stripped down reduction styled genres - reggae/dub spring to mind… some ambient stuff or composer driven minimalism aka John Cage. At its core most traditional folk music is super reductionist just because it has to be…

Thinking on this thru my narrow western rock lens - there must be a lotta other stuff out there…

Soooo - How simple can music get?

Everyone I know is into LA LOM right now. My instinct is to say that it all sounds the same, but I'm trying to get past that and see it as 'functional' music where individuality isn't the point. Is it closer to Lungfish or just polka for hipsters, I dunno.

a decision to discard possibilities can come from anywhere on the map of curiosity vs pragmatism, and there are so many aspects of expression you can apply that decision to. the power of it is in the intent and context, the 'because': "we're not doing ______ because..."

• we want to focus your & our attention on something that would otherwise be obscured.
• we simply can't play that fast / slow; independently / together; and don't have the discernment or supporting circumstances to work on it until we overcome that.
• we have deliberately put ourselves in a situation where ______ is not going to work.
• we operate from political convictions that problematises that practice or mode of expression.
• we're already have done and it's too easy now.
• i can't function in the social structure of a band but i still have feelings and judgments that demand expression

i do think it's broadly true that when a piece gives you fewer things to respond to, it's a precious opportunity to train your perception and challenge yourself to make meaning from what's left. and like pylon have it, "the more you look the more you see".

for me what i respond to in this type of work is reduction as salvage operation, as practical demonstration of how you can discard a lot of unnecessary and corrupt (i.e. meaningless) shit from (for instance) rock music in order to sustain and cultivate something vital and expressive from what you choose to keep.

there's no reason why my interpretation should be definitive, of course, but this is the greater part of what i understand by 'jam econo': not a mean dictum of 'live within your means', but rather 'act with clarity and honesty through saying no to bullshit'.

Iancee wrote: Tue Apr 08, 2025 5:53 am Soooo - How simple can music get?

Young Marble Giants?

The White Stripes could only have been simpler if Jack White had strapped a bass drum to his back and cymbals to his knees. Just a great idea for a band, and I think they used to get grief because it seemed such an obvious idea ... that others hadn't had.

Could we call Krautrock some kinda reductionist hypno-prog? More in terms of structure than the actual sound (which can get quite lush).

As for rock bands boiled down to their essence, Teenage Jesus and the Jerks (one drum! one cymbal!) and Brick Layer Cake (tres stark) both spring to mind immediately. In a positive way, I should add.

I keep thinking of The Lonesome Organist but unsure if he fits.

Would Beat Happening fit? Didn't they use a cardboard box for a drum?

I think there's also a difference between minimalism and reductionist. Minimalism can still cover a lot of ground (like the Eno, Cage, ambient examples) even though it might be quiet, spacious, or limited to a few instruments and whatnot. Reductionist seems like a commitment to doing something thing over and over, whether deliberate or by necessity. Early Ramones were reductionist, even though the footprint of the band wasn't minimalist. (a wall of Marshalls just as easily could have become a jam band or prog rock)

My brain went straight to Lindsey Buckingham banging on a box of Kleenex, or the Presidents of the United States of America with their two-string, one-string, no-string guitars, but I highly doubt that was what was intended to be discussed in this thread.