For those of us meddling in the wonderful world of 4-track, I was wondering if it is possible to get records cut straight from mixed down cassettes?

If by record you mean vinyl, and assuming that you aren't talking about a one off, there are required intermediate steps between a tape and a disk, involving the generation of the parts that make the disk, known as stampers. I forget all the terms. A disk has to be cut that serves as the mold for the stampers.

There probably are places that can cut a disk right onto teh final vinyl, for one offs of the type known as dub plates.

I see. In the case of wanting to make more than a one-off, would a pressing plant begin the process from a cassette or would it have to be from a more 'professional' source?

Shurat wrote:I see. In the case of wanting to make more than a one-off, would a pressing plant begin the process from a cassette or would it have to be from a more 'professional' source?

First problem is find the places still doing vinyl. Then I'd ask them what services they offer. Mastering, was originally the the process of cutting the master disk, from a tape source. This disk was the basis for all teh subsequent parts.

If I remember correctly, this disk would be plated, turning it into the "mother". From that the stampers would be cast. There may have been another step or two.

Older mastering labs may still have the lathes to cut disks, and whatever plants are still around might offer any number of the steps.

The cutting engineer would probably prefer to cut from a more reliable format - either analogue reel to reel, CD or from an audio workstation. Since you are in the UK it would probably be worth contacting a few vinyl brokers or mastering studios to see what they would prefer.

I'm regularly taking cassettes recorded by bands, cleaning them up and preparing them for pressing although I don't actually cut for vinyl here.

Cheers

James.

jamesp wrote:The cutting engineer would probably prefer to cut from a more reliable format - either analogue reel to reel, CD or from an audio workstation. Since you are in the UK it would probably be worth contacting a few vinyl brokers or mastering studios to see what they would prefer.

I'm regularly taking cassettes recorded by bands, cleaning them up and preparing them for pressing although I don't actually cut for vinyl here.

Cheers

James.

James,

when you do this, what format do you transfer the material onto, and is this an analogue process?

In answer to your question, yes they can. Some may charge you extra as they would if they had to resize your art or something... but yeah, it is more than possible. It is probably not the best way to present a master... it is very slow speed and low on fidelity no matter what you do. Seems like there are much better ways of making a master but hey, it's your record.

Also, I am assuming we are talking about pressing plants that do their own mastering. If not, it would be the mastering place you would be sending your cassette to.

The first record I was part of, we sent them a beta video tape as a master, covered in aluminum foil... actually the first two records I was part of. What the?

This is interesting stuff though, from the perspective of being able to make ultra-DIY recordings and take them right through to a vinyl pressing. Any old teddy and their mother can knock a cd off these days...

Paul from Aardvark http://www.aardvarkmastering.com/ can do an all-analog master from a cassette format. Note he doesn't really 'master' as much as 'straight transfer with corrections to make sure your vinyl isn't a piece of shit'. But yeah, get the plates from him and any pressing plant will be able to do it.

> records cut straight from mixed down cassettes?

Audio engineers can record anything they can hear.

But some jobs aren't worth doing.

There used to be cutters that would cut whatever you brought them, as long as you had the cash. These operators (as well as the Big Boys) mostly went out of business when the LP died. With vinyl's rebirth, there are again disc cutters, but because vinyl is a small market they are all specialty boutique services, not cheap.

Quadrasonic is a real specialty and may not be practical today: your tape must be mixed-down to 2-channel Stereo.

No engineer wants to touch your only master tape. They don't want to hear you cry if it gets broken or lost (that has happened to me). Sure, you can copy a cassette to a cassette, but the hit on sonic quality will be noticeable. Copying to digital makes more sense: most digital formats have lower gross quality loss than cassette tape, and digital can then be copied to any other format (DAT, CD, miniDisk, thumbdrive...).

Cutting wax is tricky and risky. Unlike other media that just distorts a bit, overdriving the groove will cut into the next groove, making that master unplayable. Throw out an expensive blank and valuable time, rewind, reduce cutting level, and try again. Actually, they will pre-roll several times to check levels and adjustments before they commit to wax. So disk cutters need a good reliable source tape that can be played over and over, and that will be consistent every time (cassette tape skew can vary more than the tolerances on good disk cutting).

And because cassette is really not a good source for disk cutting, there won't be a cassette deck in a typical disk cutting room. Even (maybe especially) for a hasty/cheap job, expect to pay some for the trouble to find a good deck and calibrate it to the system. Or more likely, to find a deck and transfer the tape right to CD or HD, to save wear and risk to the tape, and give a robust source for dependable cutting. Expect to pay for this "extra service".

If you dub your cassette to CDR, which can be done on a home computer, the cutting operation will be much happier. You can't hide the fact that there is tape hiss, but cutting CDR to wax is a fairly routine operation and won't get you any funny looks.

Duplication is a different operation. For one to a dozen copies, cheapest is just to ask for that many cuttings. After the first one is set up properly, it is just a little time and blanks. For more than that, you ask for a master "for pressing", and take it to a pressing plant (the disc-cutter will know, may even handle that for you). It will cost $1,000 to mold the groovy cut-master onto a ridged stamper and mount it in a press, then a few bucks each for copies. Normally they won't do less than a few hundred: they'd feel bad charging you $110 each for 10 copies, anyway it takes a while for the press to heat and they may run a dozen flawed pressings before they get good stampings. Stamping is wonderful for thousands or millions of copies, distressing for short runs.

> disk would be plated, turning it into the "mother". From that the stampers would be cast. There may have been another step or two.

Plated and then the plating peeled-off (tricky business). The peeled-off plating is the ridged master, which (when trimmed, polished, and mounted to a backing) can stamp hot plastic. For million-selling records, this master would wear-out in 10,000 stampings. There is a more elaborate process for making many stampers from one master, but that is surely not Shurat's immediate concern. If he manages to wear-out a stamper and then sell-out 10,000 vinyl platters, he'll be a Best Seller in today's vinyl world, and disk shops will be begging for his business and handling the dirty details for him.