Yeah I should specify that they can stick the rustproofing up their ass whenever I do it again. The guy giving the hard sell on it was like "I understand you don't want it, but I'm required to tell this to you." I had already been a bit of a hardass about the whole deal on basically everything to that point so instead of making it last longer by interrupting him any more and saying "who is requiring you? The president of the United States of America?" I just let him keep talking while I stared out the door. So annoying. The place I bought it from did throw in some shit I would never have spent money on but is OK to have, though, to sweeten their already low offer. Like some tasteful mud flap thingies and a nice plastic tray to protect the cargo area. Good for hauling music gear, I guess. I didn't feel like dealing with a personal sale and they could read that in me, even though I tried to pretend otherwise. Finally I had to pull out the paperwork from the offer I got from Carmax, which was lower than I was hoping for but most likely the best offer I would have gotten from anyone but a private buyer, and have them match it. There was a carmax next door and they bluffed a "you can go sell it to them and come right back" when I said "OK but I can't guarantee I'll be back" and start to stand up. Then they gave in and we had a deal.It's kind of funny how you always deal with several nice people and then eventually that guy has to go back and check on something and some guy that just exudes complete asshole shows up to talk to you. Every single time I've ever been inside of a dealership, that happens. Usually he's involved with the used cars. When I see that guy, I always get bummed out and know that I'm going to have to dig in, but the look on their face when you stonewall them on their bullshit is kind of priceless. It's a split second of confusion and sadness that you could miss if you weren't staring right at them waiting for it, before they say something like "are you sure you aren't talking about the price you could get from a private buyer?" Fuck that guy.

I have always just figured that rustproofing was useless on all cars these days. In fact, it's a term that people use for shorthand to jokingly call useless add-on junk that places like Best Buy try to upsell you on.The guy giving the spiel had a part where he brought out a small paper card. One half of it was covered in some chemical they use in the process. The other half was raw dog cardboard. The guy dripped water on both halves and of course it beads up on the treated half of the card but soaks into the untreated half. WELL NO SHIT, WATER SOAKS INTO PAPER. THE FUCKING CAR ISN'T COVERED IN PAPER, ASSHOLES. Shit like that just screams "ripoff" to me.

El Protoolio wrote:RE: Undercoating/RustproofingI kind of agree about today's cars not really needing it depending on circumstances and materials but I will say I have owned 4 different vintage VW's in my life, all from Illinois and all rusted underneath except for my last one, a blue '74 Bug. It was relatively rust free because the original owner back in 1974 bought the undercoating. It added to it's overall vintage market value because rust free VW's, espeically underneath, are basiclly extinct in the midwest. I was very happy about it. The best Bug I ever owned.Yeah I don't really doubt that rustproofing works, especially if you're talking about a 30 year old car. I'm sure it wears off at some point, though, and you'd have to pay to do it again. But if it didn't at least stop the rust from happening, there would be so many lawsuits.I'm just saying that financially, it's a ripoff. The dealer marks it up like crazy. They wanted to charge like $900 for their rustproofing at the dealer I went to. It of course also included all of this "4 Point Protection Plan" bullshit, like fabric protection, etc. How much do you think it costs them for the chemicals and the service dude's hourly wage to do it? Like $100 all in?Actually, I did have a rust spot on the Escape that I traded in. We took on a nasty scrape right next to the rust spot last year so I took it in to Maaco and they fixed the rust spot and the scrape, which included painting a whole door, for a lot less than $900. Looked like new, and stayed looking fine enough that the dealer didn't notice when they looked it over. Only car I've ever had a rust spot on. Cost me less to fix than the rustproofing.

Anybody have experience with 2001-2005 VW Passat 4motion (V6) wagons?Passed one on a lot (maybe '02?) for <$5K, looked clean (as I went by on the bus). Called the place, 120Kmi.I will likely put <10Kmi/yr on the thing. Just want to use it for 3-4 years, then upgrade.Please post if you have any thoughts either way on this model, thanks.Looks like this (but this is not it):

There was a recent This American Life about car salespeople. By the end of it, I actually felt bad for them.http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-a ... 3/129-cars

Superking wrote:madlee wrote:There was a recent This American Life about car salespeople. By the end of it, I actually felt bad for them.http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-a ... 3/129-carsI heard that!Yes, it's not something I'd like to do, especially in the Internet Age.When I bought the Fit (new), I used the "Fighting Chance" method as suggested by FM Tim Midyett.This time (If I do this thing), I'll be purchasing a used vehicle, and will be fueled by Seasonal Rage...Just wondering if car salespeople know when you are using the fighting chance method or not?

I have a 2013 CR-V and so far only really have two bad things to say about it. First, I think it looks kinda goofy. And second, I don't like how they used a soft rubber grommet to hold the windshield in place, I wish it was a much harder grommet as I'm afraid that after years of scraping snow and ice off the windshield it's gonna eventually get shredded somewhere. But that might never come to pass, maybe it's more resilient than I'm imagining. We put 10k miles on it in the one year we've owned it, love the thing. Runs like a champ, kicks ass in snow, all that. The bottom part of my driveway is a fairly steep grade, maybe 15% or so, and I always manage to get the honda up that and down it, even when I don't shovel that snow at all. So based on just the one year experience, road trips to Iowa and NYC, and driving it this whole winter, I have to say I really like it so far. Just looks a little stupid to me. But they all do,mostly, the modern SUV's

Just remembered something else. The tires, they are not cheap! But that's because it uses run-flat tires with air pressure sensors built into them. How do I know? Cause when the wife got a flat tire on the expressway at full speed (razor blade!) she was able to keep driving and get pulled off the side of the road and all that. The tire pressure light (TPMS) came on the dashboard, so that's how we were even able to figure out exactly why the car was being so weird sounding. Run flat tires with pressure sensors. Fancy shit, for it being the absolutely bottom of the barrel entry level CR-V with no features

Hello,I need someone with a clearer head than mine to advise me on the following hypothetical thing I might do this week:I currently have a 2010 Honda Fit Sport. It's got just under 50K miles on it. It's in good shape - standard little cosmetic issues for a car its age.It's been great, mostly. But it sucks in the snow. It's fine in lighter wintry situations, but today - in Chicago - it's worthless (and stuck in a parking spot on the street).Assuming I can get it out of that spot this week, I've got half a mind to drive the thing to CarMax and trade it in for a used AWD vehicle - probably a Honda (CR-V) or Toyota with higher mileage (60-75K).Price for the AWD is $15K - $19K. The Fit will probably get between $7K - $10K on trade-in.Please advise: do I need to be talked off the ledge, or is this a perfectly reasonable idea?Thanks,Mr. King

Thanks, Scott. They do look a bit goofy. I would also consider an AWD station wagon of some kind, but I've had great luck with Hondas being reliable.