Yeah, I wouldn't like a record to sound worse just in order to avoid using certain recording techniques. Should you draw the line anywhere though?

Don't know about Nevermind specifically, but drum sampling(and vocal) is a big part of Butch's dossier. Trust me.

mattw wrote:I have no idea how one can 'trigger' the drums...

Actually, it's triggering drum samples, at least as far as my feeble recording mind understands it.

There are at least five hundred thousand people on this forum who can speak with greater intelligence and authority on this subject than me. I don't think that it's a complicated concept, but I will let the better educated among us address this issue.

What say you, recording technician?

Sampling (and triggering) involves making a recording of a sound onto a sampler (eg. a snare drum sound) and then "triggering" it using MIDI. So, if you have enough samples and a MIDI sequencer, you can effectively "play" a drum beat or try to recreate the sound of a musician. On the other hand, you can also use it in a more abstract way and mess about with sounds and create "electronic" music.

n.c. wrote:I beleive in making great music using any and all tools at one's disposal. If the record sounds the way it was intended to sound it's pointless to call 'cheating' on someone.

Actually it isn't. If an engineer knows what he is doing, he should be able to make an instrument sound good without using samples. Read the last sentence over until it makes sense.

Rodabod wrote:Yeah, I wouldn't like a record to sound worse just in order to avoid using certain recording techniques. Should you draw the line anywhere though?

Fair enough. The only problem is that often it sounds worse anyway....unless you like the way Nevermind sounds.

Rog wrote:Don't know about Nevermind specifically, but drum sampling(and vocal) is a big part of Butch's dossier. Trust me.

Well, it seems that backhoescrashing into his studio play a big part in his production as well.

Noah wrote:

n.c. wrote:I beleive in making great music using any and all tools at one's disposal. If the record sounds the way it was intended to sound it's pointless to call 'cheating' on someone.

Actually it isn't. If an engineer knows what he is doing, he should be able to make an instrument sound good without using samples. Read the last sentence over until it makes sense.

Read my first setance over until it makes sense. I think that you have a pretty narrow minded veiwpoint. Look at The Microphones "Mount Eerie". Tons of studio trickery but it's a masterpeice (whether you like it or not it's a very ambitiouos and well executed recording).

Rodabod wrote:Yeah, I wouldn't like a record to sound worse just in order to avoid using certain recording techniques. Should you draw the line anywhere though?

Fair enough. The only problem is that often it sounds worse anyway....unless you like the way Nevermind sounds.

Well, I probably wouldn't make a record that sounded like "Nevermind" but the sound of that record is extremely relevent to the time it was made. I kind of wouldn't change it if I could.

Say you want your vocal to sound better, so you double it. Is that legitamate, whereas if you sample it and use the sample to double the vocal, that's somehow against the rules? What if you print the vocal to two different tracks and delay one slightly for the effect? Is that okay?

What if you heavily compress and EQ a kick drum to make every hit sound consistant? Is that okay? But using a triggered sample is all of a sudden cheating?

What if you gate a room mic and trigger it off the snare to acheive a desired effect? Really how different is that than taking a single snare hit and sampling it?

I do think that technology can be a distraction and sometimes people do things just because they can, but ruling out options just because you disagree with the way other people have used certain techniques is like not using email because some people send penis enlargement spam.

Sorry, I should have said that ruling out options just because you disagree with the way other people have used certain techniques is like not playing piano because someone used piano to play "Candle In The Wind"

n.c. wrote:Sorry, I should have said that ruling out options just because you disagree with the way other people have used certain techniques is like not playing piano because someone used piano to play "Candle In The Wind"

what about playing a piano that triggers drum samples?

1. do you like the record?

do you like the record?


2. You should only give a shit about how it was recorded if you are interested in how to make/not make it sound that way. Or are interested in the process in terms of process sake.
3. If you hear a song and like it, but all of a sudden don't like it because you found out it was recorded using triggers/samples/etc. you are a dunce.
4. Either it's crap or not crap. If they used a robot testicle to get the vocals right through the hamburglars small intestine, does it matter from a listenesrs sake? Outside of recording dorks like myself, who the fuck cares that butch vig compressed the hell out of it?
5. from a purely average listener standpoint IT DOES NOT MATTER HOW OR WHY IT WAS RECORDED, ONLY IF IT SOUNDS GOOD.

6. It only matters if it sounds the way you want it to sound. No wafle factor!