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If dub falls under the reggae umbrella, then NOT CRAP. If it doesn't, then CRAP.

I can't imagine a world without King Tubby or Scientist, but Peter Tosh and Ziggy Marley make we want to vomit.

horsewhip wrote:If dub falls under the reggae umbrella, then NOT CRAP. If it doesn't, then CRAP.

I can't imagine a world without King Tubby or Scientist, but Peter Tosh and Ziggy Marley make we want to vomit.

Augustus Pablo falls under both...and he's amazing in dub and just plain reggae...

Bradley R. Weissenberger wrote:
Try to imagine a reggae version of "Convoy". I tried to do it, and I made myself dizzy.

Brad--Does this exist? Can I hear it? Please? Oh man, "Convoy"--my first favorite song and one of the greatest songs ever. I love how it's like one big commercial for socialism.

Anyway...

I get suspicious whenever anyone dismisses a genre as huge and diverse as reggae as "crap." I mean, I know next to nothing about opera, and don't really like what I've heard, but I'd feel like a real idiot saying that opera is "crap." By the same token, how can one call an entire genre "not crap"? So I would say that C/NC does not work well with entire genres.

And please--can we all agree that rejecting a musical genre because many of its fans are alleged "hippies" is beyond crap?

Anyone who thinks they don't like reggae, but will cop to liking old soul or R&B, should pick up an early Studio One compilation. And if you think reggae is merely "mellow," listen to Augustus Pablo's "King Tubby Meets the Rockers Uptown" and tell me it doesn't still sound like some weird transmission from the future.

Sometimes current dancehall is still mindblwoing in its strangeness. "Heads High" by (I think) Sean Paul was my favorite song of a few years ago, and the one I heard coming out of cars in my neighborhod most often that summer.

Yeah, I love old ska. Does that count? I mean, I would not call the Skatalites reggae. The Studio One and Trojan stuff and also Lee Perry stuff is fun and the Congos are great, but again I seem to think of reggae as something else a little left of here. Or am I crazy?

Reggae = I dunno.
Ska = NC (original Jamaican Ska that is... not silly dressed white folk pumping it up fast an furious just to work off their Ritalin dose (with the exception of the Specials..."what do you mean oy oy oy? COURT IN SESSION!"))

A lot of that old Trojan stuff is called reggae, even though it sounds like ska to me. Either way, it's great.

All this talk about how great dub is has me confused. The college station here has a 6 hour reggae show every Sunday, and it's mostly dub, and it's almost entirely terrible. I guess I'll have to try some of the artists mentioned above...

Even though the dub I've experienced is crap, reggae as a whole is definitely not crap. Especially that old Trojan stuff.

yeah, the skatalites aren't reggae (obviously), but they were the studio one house band, appeared on tons of reggae records, and are featured in several of those trojan box sets. that's one of my favorite singles and one of my favorite songs of all time.

king tubby meets the rockers uptown is a great record, and it is weird, but it is pretty mellow so i wouldn't use it for a "all reggae isn't mellow" argument

i like dub but never want to listen to it for very long.. i have to admit i generally prefer it when used in a rock context. some reggae records i really like:

lee perry - roast fish, collie weed, and corn bread
linval thompson - i love marijuana (me too)
jimmy cliff - wonderful world, beautiful people
prince far i - under heavy manners
big youth - natty cultural dread
the harder they come - ost
culture - two sevens clash

Linus Van Pelt wrote:All this talk about how great dub is has me confused. The college station here has a 6 hour reggae show every Sunday, and it's mostly dub, and it's almost entirely terrible. I guess I'll have to try some of the artists mentioned above...

Scientist: Meets the Space Invaders, Rids the World of the Evil Curse of the Vampires, Wins the World Cup, and Encounters Pac-Man are all amazing...there are others of his that i'm sure are great but those are the ones i've heard so far...

King Tubby & Friends: Dub Gone Crazy and Dub like Dirt are both great compilations...

Keith Hudson: Pick a Dub

Augustus Pablo: King Tubbys Meets Rockers Uptown

Lee "Scratch" Perry: Blackboard Jungle Dub...Super Ape is supposed to be great, i still haven't heard it yet...

if you listen to those and don't like 'em then i guess you wouldn't like any dub...all that stuff is amazing...of course there's bad dub out there, even Scientist (my personal favorite) put out some pretty wretched garbage later on, but in general i think it's great...while i like some straight reggae and ska i think good dub easily wins...

aaron wrote:yeah, the skatalites aren't reggae (obviously), but they were the studio one house band, appeared on tons of reggae records, and are featured in several of those trojan box sets. that's one of my favorite singles and one of my favorite songs of all time.

though they did a reunion with King Tubby: Heroes of Reggae in Dub, and on that (on top of the fact that King Tubby's making it dub) their playing is more reggae than ska...it's a goddamned great record...

robert thefamilyghost wrote:Scientist: Meets the Space Invaders, Rids the World of the Evil Curse of the Vampires, Wins the World Cup, and Encounters Pac-Man are all amazing...there are others of his that i'm sure are great but those are the ones i've heard so far...

All the above are good (I am a huuuuuge Scientist fan), but the one you really want is Scientist - Dub In The Roots Tradition. It's the only one that doesn't seem to wander. The perfect expression of space/time and melody. Probably the best.

johnnyshape wrote:

robert thefamilyghost wrote:Scientist: Meets the Space Invaders, Rids the World of the Evil Curse of the Vampires, Wins the World Cup, and Encounters Pac-Man are all amazing...there are others of his that i'm sure are great but those are the ones i've heard so far...

All the above are good (I am a huuuuuge Scientist fan), but the one you really want is Scientist - Dub In The Roots Tradition. It's the only one that doesn't seem to wander. The perfect expression of space/time and melody. Probably the best.

More generally, just about anything on the Blood and Fire label is great. It's a dub-centric label, but they've put out a few non-dub records that are good too.

Speaking of Blood and Fire, The Rough Guide to Reggae was written by Steve Barrow, the label's owner, and is pretty essential for anyone interested in the music. I'm not a fan of music guides typically, but I've found this one to be worth the investment.