Premier Rock Forum

Posted: **Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:10 pm**

copower wrote:duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuudeeeeee
check out:

Dr. Octagon !
Handsome Boy Modeling School !
Del Tha Funky Homosapien !
Heiroglyphics !
Deltron 3030 !
Blackalicious !

if you havnt noticed, dan the automator has a lot to do with most of the names up there. that guy is insane, MOST of anything hes involved with is worth a shot or three.

i love all of them and i can see it being considered as an "alternative", but then again they just seem to be "overlooked". i have no idea why.

ignore the wack mc's.

Ive heard of all of these namedropped before, all the time. I've heard of a lot of the other names in this thread, too. Maybe they are not topping the charts but they aren't exactly little guys either. That's my question... it seems like most us of can name about 1000 obscure-o math rock groups which no one has ever heard yet we love their single deep to our hearts, and when it comes time to discuss hip hop it's pretty much the same 20-30 groups/artists. Maybe this is a COMPLETELY ignorant statement though -- I'm asking as someone who doesn't really listen to hip hop.

Posted: **Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:17 pm**

some of the most famous rappers arent so good. jay-z has developed one of the worst vocal deliveries in all of rap even though he used to be good (vocally). nas still writes great lyrics and writes cool flows (rhythms) into his raps, but his breath control isnt nearly as sharp as it used to be.

in the 90s there were many famous rappers who were amazing. wu tang (and all their solo releases), 2pac, bone thugs (!), dmx, nas, mobb deep, the list goes on and on.

these days there is certainly an "indie rock version of rap" but lots of them arent so great. the def jux records artists are great (el-p, aesop rock, cannibal ox, rjd2), there are some great instrumental rap artists in the underground (dj shadow, blockhead, dj krush), there is some good west coast underground rap (hieroglyphics, living legends), del is good, but most of the "underground" or "alternative" artists in rap are not that great. people who listen to this kind of rap, generally, are suckers for any raps that are "scientific," any raps that complain about the mainstream, any raps with over-the-top multisyllable coordination in the rhyme scheme (people who rhyme "toasted skin monopoly" with "roasted him probably") which often forces them to make meaningless lyrics, and anyone who rhymes "lyrical" with "miracle". many of these underground rappers sound like bad spoken word poets.

many fans of underground rap have funny theories on how there is supposedly a difference between "rap" and "hip hop". sometimes its just a matter of "rap (music) is a subset of hip hop (culture)" which makes sense. but sometimes they argue that "rap is violent and dumb while hip hop is progressive and intellectual" or some other highbrow/lowbrow distinction. this is BS because most of the best rappers have been aggressive and at least somewhat "gangsta" and full of shock value: 2pac, bone thugs, wu tang, nas, dr dre and his rappers, notorious big, kurupt.

the best rapper alive right now is bizzy bone (formerly of bone thugs n harmony). he is also just about the best male vocalist alive, maybe number 2 (behind mike patton).

btw i make rap music. i make beats for this guy: http://www.myspace.com/builtforlifesshit

Posted: **Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:20 pm**

sphincter wrote:cLOUDDEAD
Why?
MF Doom
Quasimoto
Madvillain
Anti-Pop
Tes
El-P
Cannibal Ox
Zion I
Prefuse 73
Push button Objects
RJD2
Latyrx
Slint
DJ Shadow
Cut Chemist
WaiWan
TTC
TY
Oh No
Penut Butter Wolf
J Dilla
DJ Signify
Braintax
Skinnyman
Aesop Rock
Dr.Octagon
Deltron 3030
Pelican City
Jedi Mind Tricks...

Posted: **Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:08 pm**

Anything from the 90s that Dan the Automator worked on (especially Kool Keith aka Dr. Octagon aka a bunch of other names). The Automator/Kool Keith stuff defines undie hip hop in my mind.

Pains me to say it but just read pitchfork. They're all over alt hip hop's jock. They've got more insight into that than indie rock.

Posted: **Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:11 pm**

MF DOOM. All caps when you spell the name.

Posted: **Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:25 pm**

AAAAAAAARGH wrote:... it seems like most us of can name about 1000 obscure-o math rock groups which no one has ever heard yet we love their single deep to our hearts, and when it comes time to discuss hip hop it's pretty much the same 20-30 groups/artists.

people don't typcially come to steve albini's message board to talk about the new underground hip hop album. I've got some Kool Keith and Jay Z on my ipod, but yeah, I'm here to chew fat with people who play and record jagged post punk music. I'd go to ilXor.com if I wanted to know what Kool Keith or Automator was up to.

Posted: **Tue Jan 23, 2007 11:41 pm**

nick92675 wrote:the POS record is great too - if you haven't heard it, you'd probably be suprised, hip hop sampling hardcore bands, craig finn doing verses... it's pretty good......

The song "Stand Up (Let's Get Murdered)" is excellent. One big crescendo.

Posted: **Tue Jan 23, 2007 11:49 pm**

Another element: A lot of the canonized rappers emerged when hip-hop was still young as a mainstream art form, and people with serious talent were burning their way to success.

I mean, Tupac and Wu-Tang were famous, but it's akin to saying "These Beatles and Rolling Stones, everyone says they are the greatest but they are very famous!" Yeah, no kidding.

But seriously, alternative hip-hop (I mean the good stuff, not old-skool backpacker whiney bullshit) is a huge thing, but it doesn't get as much press, comparatively. That's because... it's alternative. Nobody really talked about Gang of Four in the mainstream press until the new millenium.

Random tip: Anticon just released an album by Darc Mind called Symptomatic of a Greater Ill, which was actually recording back in the mid-late 90's and shelved. The man's flow is jaw-dropping.

Posted: **Wed Jan 24, 2007 12:14 am**

AAAAAAAARGH wrote:
copower wrote:duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuudeeeeee
check out:

Dr. Octagon !
Handsome Boy Modeling School !
Del Tha Funky Homosapien !
Heiroglyphics !
Deltron 3030 !
Blackalicious !

if you havnt noticed, dan the automator has a lot to do with most of the names up there. that guy is insane, MOST of anything hes involved with is worth a shot or three.

i love all of them and i can see it being considered as an "alternative", but then again they just seem to be "overlooked". i have no idea why.

ignore the wack mc's.

Ive heard of all of these namedropped before, all the time. I've heard of a lot of the other names in this thread, too. Maybe they are not topping the charts but they aren't exactly little guys either. That's my question... it seems like most us of can name about 1000 obscure-o math rock groups which no one has ever heard yet we love their single deep to our hearts, and when it comes time to discuss hip hop it's pretty much the same 20-30 groups/artists. Maybe this is a COMPLETELY ignorant statement though -- I'm asking as someone who doesn't really listen to hip hop.

That's because most people on here listen to indie/math stuff. You're right we can name 1000+ indie bands and 30 hip hop. It doesn't mean that that's all there is. How many rap guys talk about Shellac?

Posted: **Wed Jan 24, 2007 1:09 am**

skatingbasser wrote:
AAAAAAAARGH wrote:
copower wrote:duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuudeeeeee
check out:

Dr. Octagon !
Handsome Boy Modeling School !
Del Tha Funky Homosapien !
Heiroglyphics !
Deltron 3030 !
Blackalicious !

if you havnt noticed, dan the automator has a lot to do with most of the names up there. that guy is insane, MOST of anything hes involved with is worth a shot or three.

i love all of them and i can see it being considered as an "alternative", but then again they just seem to be "overlooked". i have no idea why.

ignore the wack mc's.

Ive heard of all of these namedropped before, all the time. I've heard of a lot of the other names in this thread, too. Maybe they are not topping the charts but they aren't exactly little guys either. That's my question... it seems like most us of can name about 1000 obscure-o math rock groups which no one has ever heard yet we love their single deep to our hearts, and when it comes time to discuss hip hop it's pretty much the same 20-30 groups/artists. Maybe this is a COMPLETELY ignorant statement though -- I'm asking as someone who doesn't really listen to hip hop.

That's because most people on here listen to indie/math stuff. You're right we can name 1000+ indie bands and 30 hip hop. It doesn't mean that that's all there is. How many rap guys talk about Shellac?

how many shellac guys talk about hip hop?

Premier Rock Forum

Why isn't alternative hip hop a "thing?"

Why isn t alternative hip hop a " thing?"

Why isn t alternative hip hop a " thing?"

Why isn t alternative hip hop a " thing?"

Why isn t alternative hip hop a " thing?"

Why isn t alternative hip hop a " thing?"

Why isn t alternative hip hop a " thing?"

Why isn t alternative hip hop a " thing?"

Why isn t alternative hip hop a " thing?"

Why isn t alternative hip hop a " thing?"

Why isn t alternative hip hop a " thing?"